DRDO and PSU's

[FalconSlayers]

Any updates on BrahMos-II? Heard they were discussing ToT of Tsirkon with Russians.

 

[shade2]

Looks like it is going to a family of different systems including the land attack and anti ship versions.

Other projects under development:

ET-LDHCM is Project Vishnu a scramjet engine powered hypersonic cruise missile.

Project Dhwani is an unpowered Hypersonic Glide Weapon which will be mounted most probably on a ICBM.

Googled this up and some post by linkedin wala came up

Atul Tripathi on LinkedIn: DRDO Initiates Project ET-LDHCM for Hypersonic Missile…

DRDO Initiates Project ET-LDHCM for Hypersonic Missile Development India's DRDO launches Project ET-LDHCM to develop hypersonic cruise missiles. The project…

www.linkedin.com

I never knew there was an Atmanirbhar hypersonic program, used to assume they'd just get the Zircon from Russis and call it BrahMos-II

 

[Blood+]

I got ur notion but there was a document with lrashm along hgv
That's the reason why many are believing hgv theory

Ok, but how is this thing supposed to, you know, glide??

 

[randombully]

Yup; one of most precise weapons to be ever developed by mankind are the KKVs on Anti-Ballistic Missile; second only to sniper rifles. After seperation they lose the forward thrust pretty quickly and simply drift toward the interception point. And for guidance use micro thrusters (or whats technically called a DACS) and even with those achieve God level of precision. The enemy warhead moving kilometres per second, this KV too moving at comparable speed and still manages to engage a target at small as one metre square.

And here we're talking about big ahh warships. Moreover it's not like a ballistic missile that if you miss all hell will break loose...even a near miss by 10m would result in pretty much a mission kill for the warship.

No, absolutely not.
And to answer why and also to address future debates I'm giving a dimensionless number; Ayan's Ratio. Use this to determine what kind of things it's.

In the last separating thing; be it HGV or MIRV or MaRV or whatever this LRAShM is find two things; the weight of the warhead and the weight of the propellant it carries. No divide the propellant by warhead; if less an 1 then glide vehicle and if more than 1 then a powered missile.

Wo sab to thik hai, par ye dara kis ko raha hai be

And your assumption is wrong because you seem to miss the point of me drawing parallel between Rudram-III and this based on the fact that both have quasi ballistic trajectory, both uses separating 1st stage, have minimal wings
It had nothing to do with velocity

Also that Mach 9 would most probably be the re-entry velocity which would decrease from that point as more and more maneuvers are made.

True, totally agreeing with that fact that even with minimal wing you can generate sufficient lift using the speed.

But now I'd ask you do help me in one thing. Take the exact shape of this re-entry vehicle of LR-AShM with its nose cone, long cylindrical body of uniform cross section and small wings...and tell me, will there be any flow separation past the ogive of nose cone?
And if yes, then would sufficient amount of air even reach the wings let alone generating lift.

and who decided that ratio of less than one or more than one decides a glide vehicle? Which agency certified this method of identifying it?
The AHW with it's design will also not be considered a glide vehicle by this definition, as it's top section which will house the warhead is highly tapered and will most likely carry more propellant in weight, yet the american army call it "hypersonic boost-GLIDE vehicle".
Rudram three has "control surfaces" , this one has wings( long fins on the body) and control surfaces at it's tail near the booster.


Yeah, Mach 5 of rudram 3 is also reentry velocity, The same for any other hypersonic thing which is not a cruise missile, the Mach 7-9 speed of dfzf glide vehicle of china is also its reentry speed.


Don't think the amount flow separation that will happen be enough to prevent it from generating sufficient lift.

Its not a blended body glide vehicle like we are used to seeing, but it can glide at hypersonic speed.

Looks like DRDO woke up and started celebrating Diwali.

Happy Diwali Folks

Happy Diwali.

 

[randombully]

Any updates on BrahMos-II? Heard they were discussing ToT of Tsirkon with Russians.

From current progress it seems Indeginous hypersonic cruise missile will comedy before 2.
There's no new development on 2, higher chances are thar it will never come to fruition.

 

[Ayan Barat]

and who decided that ratio of less than one or more than one decides a glide vehicle? Which agency certified this method of identifying it?

Akhil Bhartiya Vimaan Samandharman Samiti, Prayagraj, Uttar Pradesh

By the way this is the same agency that makes it mandatory to still call a glider "motor glider" and not a "plane" even after you add fuel, engine and a propeller to it.

Rudram three has "control surfaces" , this one has wings( long fins on the body) and control surfaces at it's tail near the booster.

What a sad, stupid hill you've chosen to die on my Guy!

I've always clearly mentioned that why I'm comparing it to Rudram-III and never said IT IS Rudram-III.

drawing parallel

Itna kya dill pe le liye!?

Also whatever tired to say in those wings and control surfaces, made no sense to me. If something moves; it's a control surface. If fixed; it's a wing. And both Rudram and this have pretty similar arrangement of these; mid-body fixed and aft movable.

Don't think the amount flow separation that will happen be enough to prevent it from generating sufficient lift.

Noice...so now it seems you're atleast slowly coming towards what I'm trying to say.
And do some CFD and find accurately, how the air would behave.

 

[Ayan Barat]

2 fins will be vertical and 2 will be horizontal, horizontal fins will generate lift

Achha

And why exactly those fins can't be in X shape!?

Resolve the force generated by each fin into its horizontal and vertical components and then add up all the vertical components.

 

[randombully]

Achha

And why exactly those fins can't be in X shape!?
View attachment 15595
Resolve the force generated by each fin into its horizontal and vertical components and then add up all the vertical components.

Hfs, alright my loss, forgot the 10standard vectors.
But still those fins don't need to be aerofoil shape, flat surfaces can still generate lift at an angle.
When the missile descents downwards the horizontal fins can generate lift while the vertical fins will just cut through the air as they are perpendicular to it.

 

[jaijaganath]

Ok, but how is this thing supposed to, you know, glide??

Even I am not convinced with the hgv logic that's why I feel @Ayan Barat ji analogy pretty much accurate
I was stating why people were claiming it to be hgv
But practically it doesn't seem to have warhead(supposedly hgv) separating from missile
Apart from 1st stage which seems to be of k4 entire missile seems to remain intact atleast if we study the poster

 

[vampyrbladez]

View: https://x.com/alpha_defense/status/1858063867060146334

 

[vampyrbladez]

Enough of utter chaos going on this thread since morning...let me too contribute one last time in this

What have been tested is more or less just a ground launched, ER version of Rudram-III. PERIOD
View attachment 15577
• There's isn't any absolute contemporary to this that I can compare it to, just like SMART.
• The closest in terms of concept would be the Aster-15/30 but again, those are SAMs.
• The closest in terms of concept among Ballistic Missiles would be Rudram-III
• Neither an air-breathing thing like HSTDV
• Nor a glide vehicle as we all had earlier assumed from that single cutaway pic. (Side note; whoever made that model/cutaway should be tried for treason)
• Just a simple Rudram-III like set-up where you've a booster that separate after initial launch and then the missile continues with its own motor
• Wings are minimalistic and helps more in countering roll/pitch/yaw than generating lift; like Rudram-III
• Follows pretty much the same quasi-ballistic path followed by other contemporaries like Shaurya/LORA
View attachment 15579
• Only difference being more propellant compared to others in 2nd stage resulting in longer burn; more power to lose energy in maneuvering while evading defences and still having enough to regain speed.
• Saying it's hypersonic and doing the usual "Bharat ka hypersonic jawaab, Pakistan bola aap hi mere Baap" or "Hindustan ka naya Brahmastra, Modi ne kiya Xi ko parast" (daamn, I'm getting quite good at this) on TV/YouTube would glorify this too much; undermining the long way we still have to cover in this field.
Saying it's hypersonic is like saying a rifle round is supersonic or a torpedo is waterproof.

And some personal takes that's just pure yapping backed by my brainrot

* The warhead looks like the one from BrahMos based on the dimensions
* The second stage looks like Shaurya; but shorter though
* It'll be tough firing it from a ship, as claimed earlier given it's size and thrust
* Deploying just three batteries in Gujarat, Kerala and Andaman would effectively solve most of the naval "defence" issue

View: https://x.com/GODOFPARADOXES/status/1658523884616810501

 

[vampyrbladez]

This would be a better example of a traditional HGV used in AGNI 5


View: https://x.com/Beingadiisingh/status/1603448574309605376

 

[randombully]

View: https://x.com/SJha1618/status/1858014816461312183

If this test is supposed to be ASHBM test, then when was HGV-AShM test was done?

 

[randombully]

 

[randombully]

View attachment 15604View attachment 15605View attachment 15606

So this guy who claims to be a PhD candidate in space security is also claiming along with Saurabh Jha that we have already tested our hgv. When did it happened?

 

[jaijaganath]

So this guy who claims to be a PhD candidate in space security is also claiming along with Saurabh Jha that we have already tested our hgv. When did it happened?

This one

This would be a better example of a traditional HGV used in AGNI 5


View: https://x.com/Beingadiisingh/status/1603448574309605376

 

[randombully]

This one

DRDO Expert Speaks
However, former Defence Research Development Organization (DRDO) scientist Dr. Prahlada said it doesn’t look like a hypersonic glide vehicle (HGV) test, with the only difference being the timing of the test being late evening or night hours.

“Moreover, the curvature of the earth and its position in space makes objects going farther away or higher appear as they are heading down.

This is all the more amplified in videos, and it would be difficult to conclude whether it was an HGV test or some other purpose until the launch video is available,” Prahlada said.

When filing this report, the DRDO was yet to comment on testing or release the launch footage.

There were claims that DRDO used low speed and a depressed trajectory to hide its actual range and true potential. “If they had used true potential, speed, and optimal trajectory, the missile would have gone further. This means the actual range is far greater than 5000 km. DRDO fired along the lowest line on the graph to achieve the target distance of 5000 km,” an observer noted.

By “lowest line on the graph,” the comment referred to the three different trajectories of ballistic missiles, all of which follow a parabolic path and leave the atmosphere before reentering it to descend on its target.

Plotted on a graph, they become three large parabolas with different heights and arches, with the lowest one almost hugging and running parallel to the earth’s curvature, possibly still within the atmosphere – or ‘endo-atmospheric’ in military-technical terms.

 

[vampyrbladez]

Could the second stage be there in the missile to address this problem?

Despite the difficulties that HGVs pose for mid-course ABM interception by systems like SM-3 and GBI, HGVs have yet to overcome substantial obstacles in order to achieve the same success in the terminal phase. For one thing, HGVs can only maneuver drastically in the mid-course phase of their flight path due to extreme pressures during their terminal phase.

Additionally, contemporary SAM systems like THAAD, PATRIOT and SM-6 are mostly optimized for terminal phase interception, with the exception of SM-3 and GBI. Furthermore, when HGVs re-enter the atmosphere at hypersonic velocities a plasma sheet will develop which disrupts their communications and sensors.

There are two solutions to this. Firstly, HGVs can slow down to supersonic speeds, but this wouldn't make their terminal phase interception any harder than the missiles that current SAMs are designed to intercept.

Secondly, HGVs can maintain hypersonic speeds and rely on inertial navigation systems, though this would mean that HGVs can't target maneuvering targets like expensive aircraft carriers, yet these are the exact targets that are valuable enough for HGVs with costs in the tens of millions each, to be worth targeting. These factors have likely contributed to DF-ZF currently being used for a land-attack role only, although an anti-ship variant is in development.

Source : DF-ZF​

 

[randombully]

Wait a minute, dfzf is not carrier killer capable yet?

 

[randombully]

Wait a minute, dfzf is not carrier killer capable yet?

So from all the internet searching I did, it seems that anti ship version of dfzf Is still in development, most likely later stages of development called df27.