DRDO and PSU's

[Bleh]

View: https://x.com/ocf_avadi/status/1884237060309148154?s=61&t=yuvGwS0cN0KJv4VlBwTZFg

OCF Avadi has secured an Export Order of Uniforms for the Suriname Army and has begun delivery of them.

That camo is better than ours

 

[Corvus Splendens]

That camo is better than ours

Camo ? compare the angled chest pockets, smart velcro contact points, zipper + button arrangement, no shoulder board/epaulettes, sleeve pockets, velcro cuffs, velcro ankle points, integral knee pad pockets. It's a far superior and modern uniform than what we inducted in 2022.

 

[Azaad]

Pralay isn't heavy. Weighs just 5.1 tons.

I was also wondering whether Dr BK Das meant LR anti ship missile when he mentioned upto 1500 km range.

There's a new variant of K-15 having extended range. Shaurya is land based K-15 and it doesn't have the necessary structural strength and stiffness required for underwater launch. So Shaurya is lighter than K-15. Now this new K-15 version has a composite airframe and uses newer solid propellants. So there will also be a corresponding Shaurya variant.

Pralay is Shaurya without the solid booster.

Shaurya is currently under the SFC. Under whose command would this new variant of the Shaurya you're speaking of be? The upcoming Indian Rocket Force Command or the SFC? And what is the range going to be like? 1500 kms?

 

[Ayan Barat]

And what is the range going to be like? 1500 kms?

 

[Hawkeye]

Camo ? compare the angled chest pockets, smart velcro contact points, zipper + button arrangement, no shoulder board/epaulettes, sleeve pockets, velcro cuffs, velcro ankle points, integral knee pad pockets. It's a far superior and modern uniform than what we inducted in 2022.

Really makes you question the credibility of people who chose our new so called modern camo uniform.
And well, people like to blame ofb, me as well but the more I learn, the more owari da for us situation becomes.

 

[Patriots]

View: https://x.com/UstadMaverick/status/1884290096909934723

 

[Bleh]

It gas begun. TEDBF 1st flight pushed back to 2029...

ADA Resets Timeline for TEDBF Program After Bureaucratic Delays – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

 

[karn]

View: https://x.com/UstadMaverick/status/1884290096909934723

This system should 1v 1 the solar industries antidrone system .

 

[bakofbakchod]

It gas begun. TEDBF 1st flight pushed back to 2029...

ADA Resets Timeline for TEDBF Program After Bureaucratic Delays – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

2039*** this project has not even taken off the paper yet. What is with meaningless timelines which will not be met

 

[Hawkeye]

View attachment 23402

Any idea what would be the deviation due to new composite body and different fuel loading for pralay missile. My guess estimate is around 800km for 500kg warhead, on conservative side.

 

[Srinivas]

Good for them that they've finally realised the need to speedrun sales before the window closes; pretty soon the market is going to get flooded by analogues.
If they don't put whatever money they're getting from this deal into NG's R&D, then they're going to regret it badly.

K-Pop BrahMos currently is advanced testing
View attachment 23171

No country can match India’s pricing and experience in supersonic cruise missile, except Russia .

 

[fire starter]

View: https://x.com/silver07shield/status/1884503277204537516?t=f53yOO5-FXXx7ezICpkWew&s=19

 

[Ayan Barat]

No country can match India’s pricing and experience in supersonic cruise missile, except Russia .

Talos (1955), Bomarc (1958), ASMP (1986), Bloodhound (1958), Sea Dart in (1973)...so saying that we're the most experienced would be bit of an overstretch. Contractors have mastered ramjet propulsion and cruise missile technology decades before us, it's just that they didn't try to compete in this niche before 2005. They were more concerned with developing counters for supersonic cruise missile as it was an adversarial threat.

As for price; yes, we can theoretically produce things cheaper than others. But there are numerous other things that goes in pricing decision than just the availability of cheap labour; take the price of BrahMos itself for example. From economies of scale to how much margin one can reduce, n number of factors. One of the biggest factor of pricing is the availability of cheaper dual use items that come from non defence sectors. Let's say you've conceptualized a new missile that because of its clever design manages to reduce cost but as soon you'll starts placing orders with other local firms for items like screws, actuators, drivers, CNC service, sensors...you'd realise how exorbitantly high they charge. But you're in defence so like automobile or consumer you don't have the luxury to import these from China.

 

[Ayan Barat]

Weren't they making a separate range extension kit for that role?? Tara or something??

Yup, TARA.
But it's only for 250kg and 500kg HSLD bombs. It's basically the further evolution of PG-HSLD series.

Except that we don't manufacture any 2000lbs dumb bombs as of now and it's not really laying everywhere atleast in India. And anyway Gaurav or G....series bombs is fine as long as they can keep the per unit cost reasonably low and order it in much larger numbers.

Prashun Da, 2014

Any idea what would be the deviation due to new composite body and different fuel loading for pralay missile. My guess estimate is around 800km for 500kg warhead, on conservative side.

It would be extremely tough my Guy without knowing every single parameter like what thickness was the older maraging steel casing, what epoxy they're using with carbon fibre, how much is the weight of propellant...

For timepass we can play with the publicly known numbers of Agni
• Agni-1, steel casing : D1x15m, 12t weight and 1,200km range with 1t warhead
• Agni-P, composite casing : D1.15x10.5m, 11t weight and 2,000km range with 1.5t warhead

So guess we can expect an increase of around 25% in both the warhead and range. I don't know, my math's not mathing

 

[Azaad]

View: https://x.com/silver07shield/status/1884503277204537516?t=f53yOO5-FXXx7ezICpkWew&s=19

I'm veering around to the PoV that there are 2 possible scenarios - it's not so much Jizia as a requirement projected by the IA. Why exactly has the IA opted for the Strykers though as opposed to indigenous alternatives I've no idea as prima facie we can develop the indigenous alternatives to fill in the role of the Stryker ?! Perhaps better informed members can weigh in.

The other PoV is this is the least disruptive procurement we can think off & possibly the least expensive option . Frankly I don't see more Apaches or Chinooks coming in or even P-8i or the C-130J .

The Apaches are probably redundant once the LCH made an appearance not that the two are comparable but there's certainly an overlap of roles. Ditto for the P-8i once we signed the contract for Sea Guardians.

There's still a case to be made for the other two though & with Trump back , if he exerts more pressure we'd probably exercise our options for the Apaches & P-8i too.

 

[Hawkeye]

Yup, TARA.
But it's only for 250kg and 500kg HSLD bombs. It's basically the further evolution of PG-HSLD series.

Prashun Da, 2014
View attachment 23427

Any photos of it ever being in use with iAF. Couldn't find one.
Prasun ji has been wrong on many things before. In the same article you quoted, there's mention of the same 1000kg bomb offered with a glide kit made with joint Collab with Russians. Yeah, now today is 2025, I highly doubt that.

According to 3rd positive indigenization list, there is an entry of REK kit for a 1000kg HS bomb. Only puzzle is where is the said HS bomb. And why the hell haven't we ever seen this bomb anywhere with IAF.

Maybe they got the nag treatment and never got orders.

 

[Ayan Barat]

Why exactly has the IA opted for the Strykers though as opposed to indigenous alternatives I've no idea as prima facie we can develop the indigenous alternatives to fill in the role of the Stryker ?!

Well that's exactly why there's so much confusion regarding this Stryker deal.
In other platforms there are atleast some molehills that can be made into mountain to justify procurement of foreign contemporaries like recoil of 7.62x51mm rifle was high so SIG 716i or "issues" with Arjun so more T-90s...but there's virtually nothing like these in case of Kestrel. Infact on paper it's better than Stryker.

There's still a case to be made for the other two though & with Trump back , if he exerts more pressure we'd probably exercise our options for the Apaches & P-8i too.

Of all the things that USA can give us, the most lucrative one for us would be the ToT of some advances jet engines, followed by a lots of C-17s (for tanker, AWACS). If we can get F-35s with end user authority like Israel and not like say Singapore, then not bad; otherwise those two would be more than enough. Every other thing can be made in-house.

 

[Blood+]

Talos (1955), Bomarc (1958), ASMP (1986), Bloodhound (1958), Sea Dart in (1973)...so saying that we're the most experienced would be bit of an overstretch. Contractors have mastered ramjet propulsion and cruise missile technology decades before us, it's just that they didn't try to compete in this niche before 2005. They were more concerned with developing counters for supersonic cruise missile as it was an adversarial threat.

As for price; yes, we can theoretically produce things cheaper than others. But there are numerous other things that goes in pricing decision than just the availability of cheap labour; take the price of BrahMos itself for example. From economies of scale to how much margin one can reduce, n number of factors. One of the biggest factor of pricing is the availability of cheaper dual use items that come from non defence sectors. Let's say you've conceptualized a new missile that because of its clever design manages to reduce cost but as soon you'll starts placing orders with other local firms for items like screws, actuators, drivers, CNC service, sensors...you'd realise how exorbitantly high they charge. But you're in defence so like automobile or consumer you don't have the luxury to import these from China.

Any idea how much a BrahMos is going for these days (for us I mean, not export customers). Can't seem to get a definitive figure on the internet.

Prashun Da, 2014

Speaking of, I wonder what happened to that gentleman.

 

[Hawkeye]

I'm veering around to the PoV that there are 2 possible scenarios - it's not so much Jizia as a requirement projected by the IA. Why exactly has the IA opted for the Strykers though as opposed to indigenous alternatives I've no idea as prima facie we can develop the indigenous alternatives to fill in the role of the Stryker ?! Perhaps better informed members can weigh in.

The other PoV is this is the least disruptive procurement we can think off & possibly the least expensive option . Frankly I don't see more Apaches or Chinooks coming in or even P-8i or the C-130J .

The Apaches are probably redundant once the LCH made an appearance not that the two are comparable but there's certainly an overlap of roles. Ditto for the P-8i once we signed the contract for Sea Guardians.

There's still a case to be made for the other two though & with Trump back , if he exerts more pressure we'd probably exercise our options for the Apaches & P-8i too.

I have just one PoV. If government can shove down agniveer in army, they surely can shove few thousands Whaps and other indigenous weapons as well with a little bit of push. Or maybe the officer, generals cadre didn't cared much as they weren't met with a similiar agniveer like system so basically only the lower ranks were affected that is the humble jawan to whom which we can't even give proper equipment but happily order gold plated apaches.

I was hoping for more reforms in armed forces structure from this government, but now I hate them for bending this much and probably will continue to do so more.

The way I see it, china introduced medium combined armed brigades aeons ago with main vehicle being 8*8 armoured vehicles like Whap class and their numerous variants. They probably have 3000+ as of now.

Otoh, we have Indian army which hasn't really adopted any new science/art of combat concepts enmass. Number of Whap with IA is not even 100.

Yeah, that's a huge China win in my books.

I just imagine the sight of PLA heavy, medium, high mobility and light CABs rolling towards us while we refuse to adopt our Whaps.

To me it seems we were somewhere really good around 70s and maybe mid 80s but I don't know where we went wrong. The whole thing is crashing down and I can't see if our guys even want to compete with PLA guys.

 

[Ayan Barat]

Any idea how much a BrahMos is going for these days (for us I mean, not export customers). Can't seem to get a definitive figure on the internet.

S-ti-may-shion

Even if we consider per unit cost to be $5 million then total cost of BrahMos would be $1.92 billion.
[if backward calculated from the 220 piece Navy order worth $2.3 billion then it'd a whopping $10 million; I went with the 2007 Army order of 72 (one reg) for $83 million and then adjusted it for inflation]

Speaking of, I wonder what happened to that gentleman.

Most probably Dada ran out of green ink for watermarking, so decided to stop writing articles

I just imagine the sight

Might help in imagining...