IAF's ISTAR Aircraft.

[fire starter]

 

[fire starter]

Some info about LORROS system - It will have 7 bands (4 EO and 3 IR)

SAR sensor will have resolution of 1m in strip mode and 0.1m in spot mode.

 

[Arad Operator]

Not coming before 2030!

 

[125mm_Smoothbore]

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

Perhaps this could be merged with SIGINT thread.

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

Guys, is there any platform which is = AWACS + JSTARS?

 

[VictorDelta4]

https://www.aninews.in/news/national/general-news/iaf-to-get-rs-10000-crore-indigenous-i-star-spy-planes-to-help-in-precision-strikes-against-enemy-ground-targets20250608201017/

 

[snakeeyes07]

 

[randombully]

Guys, is there any platform which is = AWACS + JSTARS?

View attachment 2702

Saab global eye.

 

[FalconSlayers]

Saab global eye.

I wonder why haven't we acquired it directly instead of wasting time on tendering aircrafts and then wasting decades to build own sensors without simultaneously importing them as a stopgap?

 

[randombully]

I wonder why haven't we acquired it directly instead of wasting time on tendering aircrafts and then wasting decades to build own sensors without simultaneously importing them as a stopgap?

Saab global Program was launched in 2015-2016, first jet delivered in late 2020s.
Domestic programs were already launched before it was developed, and it's radars are not that powerful, it's air search awacs radar is Netra mk1 level.
It just mixes the role of awacs, maritime surveillance and istar in one platform for cost saving reasons.


The Netra mk2 we are developing will also be capable of signit, elnit, command and control, relay( though all modern awacs should be able to do these) but it will also have
maritime surveillance and ground surveillance radars incorporated just like saab globaleye, with more powerful systems.

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

Saab global eye.

So why rest of the world including us have not developed such a platform when fighter jets have evolved to have joint AA & AG modes by sensor fused avionics?

 

[randombully]

So why rest of the world including us have not developed such a platform when fighter jets have evolved to have joint AA & AG modes by sensor fused avionics?

1, power needs, in past power was not enough for multiple types of systems to be out in one airframe.

2, now that it is, multi mission aircraft are being made,
Like saab globaleye, china is developing next gen of it's awacs into multi mission, our netra mk2 will also carry a sar radar for maritime and ground surveillance.

Some countries like US are moving away from vunerable large concentrated platforms( especially when china is specially gearing up to target those over pacific, the entire strategy of these mf's is to target US force multiplyers) into more smaller distributed systems.

3, Satellites with SAR radar are replacing the need of these platforms to some extent.

Saab global Program was launched in 2015-2016, first jet delivered in late 2020s.
Domestic programs were already launched before it was developed, and it's radars are not that powerful, it's air search awacs radar is Netra mk1 level.
It just mixes the role of awacs, maritime surveillance and istar in one platform for cost saving reasons.


The Netra mk2 we are developing will also be capable of signit, elnit, command and control, relay( though all modern awacs should be able to do these) but it will also have
maritime surveillance and ground surveillance radars incorporated just like saab globaleye, with more powerful systems.

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

1, power needs, in past power was not enough for multiple types of systems to be out in one airframe.

2, now that it is, multi mission aircraft are being made,
Like saab globaleye, china is developing next gen of it's awacs into multi mission, our netra mk2 will also carry a sar radar for maritime and ground surveillance.

Some countries like US are moving away from vunerable large concentrated platforms( especially when china is specially gearing up to target those over pacific, the entire strategy of these mf's is to target US force multiplyers) into more smaller distributed systems.

3, Satellites with SAR radar are replacing the need of these platforms to some extent.

If ISTAR in a mission with fighter aircrafts....can it replace aircraft's targetting pods? can it guide other fighter aircraft's bombs nd missiles on any enemy ground targets. or it only use for surveillance or reconnaissance missions.

 

[VictorDelta4]

Wasn't TATA fielding its own High Alt recon aircraft design with a German aircraft? What happened to that? I would guess they are going to run simultaneously.

 

[VictorDelta4]

If ISTAR in a mission with fighter aircrafts....can it replace aircraft's targetting pods? can it guide other fighter aircraft's bombs nd missiles on any enemy ground targets.

In theory yes. In the future conflicts you can expect the ISTARs to guide to its target.

 

[randombully]

If ISTAR in a mission with fighter aircrafts....can it replace aircraft's targetting pods? can it guide other fighter aircraft's bombs nd missiles on any enemy ground targets. or it only use for surveillance or reconnaissance missions.

For most modern guided bombs.
They just need target acquisition data/ initial target lock( which istar can provide via datalink), like gps guided, ins, IR/EO unit on bomb for guidance.

Some do.

Like laser guided.
Now they follow, so whichever platform( can even be a team of humans on ground lasing the target, but most of the time its fighter jet with laser designator lasing the target when these bombs are used) is lasing the target will guide the bomb.
But there usage has been decreasing more and more In modern conflicts.
As it requires fighter to loiter near target area, which puts the fighter jet under lot of risk.
But with ucav becoming common, laser guided bombs can make a small comeback.


Then there are man in the loop weapons.
Basically weapon/bomb sends the sensor data/feed( can also be camera feed, infrared imagery etc) back to the fighter jet, and pilot manually guides the weapons using that data in real time. But they are outdated, going extinct in the future.

Now you wouldn't wanna make a istar platform actually loiter and guide the weapons and put it at harms way , it's an expensive, large rcs and realtively slow platform.
But it can and will provide initial target lock directly to fire and forget bombs/stand off munitions or to fighter jets and command centres when needed.

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

1, power needs, in past power was not enough for multiple types of systems to be out in one airframe.

2, now that it is, multi mission aircraft are being made,
Like saab globaleye, china is developing next gen of it's awacs into multi mission, our netra mk2 will also carry a sar radar for maritime and ground surveillance.

Some countries like US are moving away from vunerable large concentrated platforms( especially when china is specially gearing up to target those over pacific, the entire strategy of these mf's is to target US force multiplyers) into more smaller distributed systems.

3, Satellites with SAR radar are replacing the need of these platforms to some extent.

I read that E-10 was supposed to be combo of E-3 AWACS & E-8 JSTARS, but got cancelled due to budget issues. But there are possibilities that E-7 Wedgtail or E-8 would be upgraded to be ultimately a multi-role platform. GaN with lesser power is there. IDK which civil engine produces how much electricity but something will come out finally.

When 6gen fighters quote to have DEW-CIWS, the same can be placed on AWACS.

RF, EO satellites are there but they can't replace entire AWACS, JSTARS fleet bcoz their power is limited through solar panels, RTG (Radio-isotope Thermo-electric Generator) & they have to orbit so can't stay over a region for long. A constellation would be needed which is also costly matter. If they are shot at then it'll create more dangerous orbital debris.

 

[randombully]

I read that E-10 was supposed to be combo of E-3 AWACS & E-8 JSTARS, but got cancelled due to budget issues. But there are possibilities that E-7 Wedgtail or E-8 would be upgraded to be ultimately a multi-role platform. GaN with lesser power is there. IDK which civil engine produces how much electricity but something will come out finally.

When 6gen fighters quote to have DEW-CIWS, the same can be placed on AWACS.

RF, EO satellites are there but they can't replace entire AWACS, JSTARS fleet bcoz their power is limited through solar panels, RTG (Radio-isotope Thermo-electric Generator) & they have to orbit so can't stay over a region for long. A constellation would be needed which is also costly matter. If they are shot at then it'll create more dangerous orbital debris.

One part of distributed systems US is creating is rumoured RQ-180 stealth flying wing drone, rumored to be replacement of ISTAR jets( lots more stealthy, will fly higher), though will also have lot more other network Centric and electronic-signal intelligence that all modern force multiplyers will have.
US also uses it's rq-4 global hawk drone hale uav for istar role( depending on the payload), there are also modular payload for mq9 reaper/sea guardian for istar role.

So they are not fully relying on satellites too.
But istar needs to operate relatively more close to enemy compared to awacs and other larger force multiplyers.


So u2 spy plane, E-8, rc12x, E0-5c dash etc will be replaced by distributed and "relatively" more expendable "drones"( male, hale, large flying wings depending on the payload) further supported by very large constellation of sar satellites in space that US is also planning

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

If ISTAR in a mission with fighter aircrafts....can it replace aircraft's targetting pods? can it guide other fighter aircraft's bombs nd missiles on any enemy ground targets. or it only use for surveillance or reconnaissance missions.

The targeting pod targets by laser pulses whose strength will decrease rapidly due to scattering at large distances. So ISTAR can't replace the EO pods but the EOTS has already replaced the pods, the laser unit is a small thing.
However, the RF missiles can be guided by AWACS, either semi-ARH (Active Radar Homing) or mid-course update.
The smart bombs, cruise missiles & other AGMs have their own midcourse & terminal guidance like GPS, INS, SatNav, DSMAC, TERCOM, IIR, PRH, ARH, RadAlt, etc.
But the data from ground SAR (Synthetic Aperture Radar) mapping, GMT (Ground target Moving Indicator) can be passed on to a weapon as an approximate coordinate, refined by weapon's own terminal guidance.