Indian Economy

[ArjunMK1A]

Hero is missing a passionate guy like Siddarth who could do turn around like for enfield or good tie ups like Bajaj(ktm, Triumph). Also split in Munjal family operating two different electric vehcile scooter companies but both starting with HERO name added to confusion.

They need a good sales guy. Their product engineering is actually very good. Xtreme, Karizma chassis were all good to drive. Even engines are good. Quality of switchgears were a concern but in recent Destini 125 scooter even that has been improved a lot.

But the big problem is their sales centers were not enough to handle their volume. Technicians were overburdened with number of splendors thus they don't have any bandwidth to service bigger bikes.

They need an Premium Sales outlet for higher end products. Maruti started Nexa to provide premium sales and service for an reason. Otherwise you will not going to sit an crowded showroom of arena waiting with your Grand Vitara among the large number altos, wagonr.

Humans are picky.

 

[haldilal]

the irony, this makes the sons a better business people than the father. father wanted gormint to do favours to Indian companies when competing with foreign companies, sons have proved that when you have better product strategy you don't need gormint support. (?)

Ya'll the strategy only started in late 80's with sunny, ZIP, and other products being introduced and being developed, under Rahul Bajaj leadership, Rajiv Baja didn't taken R&D and Engineering post till 95, and the result of that was the pulsar.

 

[ezsasa]

Ya'll the strategy only started in late 80's with sunny, ZIP, and other products being introduced and being developed, under Rahul Bajaj leadership, Rajiv Baja didn't taken R&D and Engineering post till 95, and the result of that was the pulsar.

my roommates used to have boxer and calibre, most of their "innovation" happened after their JV with kawasaki.

funny thing about boxer is that it didn't have a battery, meaning headlight will work only when engine is on. they were competing on price by reduced features with splendour and yamaha.

 

[SKC]

my roommates used to have boxer and calibre, most of their "innovation" happened after their JV with kawasaki.

funny thing about boxer is that it didn't have a battery, meaning headlight will work only when engine is on. they were competing on price by reduced features with splendour and yamaha.
View attachment 10423

Two-Wheeler is the sector where Indian Companies really absorbed the technology and manufacturing know-how from World Players:

1. Hero-Honda
2. Bajaj-Kawasaki
3. TVS-Suzuki

These JV happened in 80s and 90s and our players quickly learn the latest tech and were able to implement in their own products.​

 

[haldilal]

my roommates used to have boxer and calibre, most of their "innovation" happened after their JV with kawasaki.

funny thing about boxer is that it didn't have a battery, meaning headlight will work only when engine is on. they were competing on price by reduced features with splendour and yamaha.
View attachment 10423

Ya'll Those were the day's of cutbacks and compromise's, today can't even think of such things, we have came a lot from those times, with folks ready spend any amount of money.

 

[ezsasa]

Ya'll Those were the day's of cutbacks and compromise's, today can't even think of such things, we have came a lot from those times, with folks ready spend any amount of money.

another way to look at it, is that we were/are a cost conscious market. difference between boxer-calibre-splendour was a few thousand ₹. boxer with tax would be 35k, calibre/splendour with tax would be around 41k.

it's just been a few years since liberalisation, companies were still figuring out the dynamics of a post-license raj market.

 

[haldilal]

Two-Wheeler is the sector where Indian Companies really absorbed the technology and manufacturing know-how from World Players:

1. Hero-Honda
2. Bajaj-Kawasaki
3. TVS-Suzuki

These JV happened in 80s and 90s and our players quickly learn the latest tech and were able to implement in their own products.​

Ya'll Bajaj Divorce with Kawasaki was not a as clean like the Hero and Honda, just like Mahindra who's J.V prospective with Ford ended in disaster, both applied similar principles and techniques to cut down the cost and time in the R&D and that was supplier based parts and testing and not developing everything by themselves. The results were the Pulsar and Scorpio.

And even now almost allow Indian Automobile firms adhere by this principles. unlike the other outside firms who still follow most of the R&D inhouse.

The only difference is that compared to previously, currently all the firms stick stick norms and quality even for a supplier developed and off the self parts to increase the reliability and combability.

 

[SKC]

Ya'll Bajaj Divorce with Kawasaki was not a as clean like the Hero and Honda, just like Mahindra who's J.V prospective with Ford ended in disaster, both applied similar principles and techniques to cut down the cost and time in the R&D and that was supplier based parts and testing and not developing everything by themselves. The results were the Pulsar and Scorpio.

And even now almost allow Indian Automobile firms adhere by this principles. unlike the other outside firms who still follow most of the R&D inhouse.

The only difference is that compared to previously, currently all the firms stick stick norms and quality even for a supplier developed and off the self parts to increase the reliability and combability.

Thats not the point we are discussing. We are talking about how well Indian players absorbed the latest tech from their Japanese Counterpart and displaced them from Top positions in Indian market.

 

[Illusive]

Bajaj really built on their Pulsar brand while Hero hasnt. Hero has a great product with X pulse but they need to be bring new iterations and higher cc variants. They have been quite slow.

Indian bike market is huge and its moving slowly towards 400-600 cc segment which is seeing huge growth internationally and even companies like Aprilia and Triumph are offering 400 cc bikes made in India to global customers. Triumph has been very successful. They have big launch events.

 

[Aaj Ka Hero]

Bajaj really built on their Pulsar brand while Hero hasnt. Hero has a great product with X pulse but they need to be bring new iterations and higher cc variants. They have been quite slow.

Indian bike market is huge and its moving slowly towards 400-600 cc segment which is seeing huge growth internationally and even companies like Aprilia and Triumph are offering 400 cc bikes made in India to global customers. Triumph has been very successful. They have big launch events.

No...No...what India two wheeler market right now need is Motorola type of launches.
If any Indian company can do it, great.

 

[haldilal]

Thats not the point we are discussing. We are talking about how well Indian players absorbed the latest tech from their Japanese Counterpart and displaced them from Top positions in Indian market.

Ya'll Bajaj had less than a decade J.V with Kawasaki, unlike Hero Honda and didn't got that much technology absorption, the T&C were different in both the cases, most of their change started in house after Rajiv Bajaj. In 1990's it become extremely limited on TOT and the finally remaining co operations limited to the distributions which was dormant since that decade was officially over in 2017.

The only significant TOT was the engine. Unlike Hero Honda where the hero got almost everything from the Honda.

 

[ezsasa]

No...No...what India two wheeler market right now need is Motorola type of launches.
If any Indian company can do it, great.

what is "Motorola type of launches"?

 

[haldilal]

what is "Motorola type of launches"?

Ya'll Flash sales, do large Marketing and advertising of new product, produce limited number of products and create noise about it how it got sold in seconds. this only works in Electronics not in Automobiles.

 

[SKC]

Ya'll Bajaj had less than a decade J.V with Kawasaki, unlike Her Honda and didn't got that much technology observations the T&C were different in both the cases, most of their change started in house after Rajiv Bajaj. In 1990's it become extremely limited on TOT and the finally remaining co operations limited to the distributions which was dormant since that decade was officially over in 2017.

The only significant TOT was the engine. Unlike Hero Honda where the hero got almost everything from the Honda.

Both Hero and Bajaj got tech transfer for Engines from their partners.

Hero got that 97cc engine which they worked on and made their version with ~103-104cc output.

Similarly, Bajaj worked on 115cc engine with Kawasaki and improved upon it and had their own iterations later on. They got the engine tech from 390 series engine from KTM and doing their own bikes with the same.​

 

[SKC]

Ya'll Flash sales, do large Marketing and advertising of new product, produce limited number of products and create noise about it how it got sold in seconds. this only works in Electronics not in Automobiles.

That is not possible with Automobiles.

The Supply lines, manufacturing lines and design and BOM are started years in advance before the product is launched in the market. It is not plug-n-play thing where we can attach the components in few weeks and launch new product every month.​

 

[ezsasa]

if this ship building policy works out, IN will be a beneficiary.
=====

Centre in talks with coastal states on shipbuilding clusters in India​

https://www.business-standard.com/i...india-with-coastal-states-124091301393_1.html

In next five years, we will be among the world's top 10 ship builders. For ship building and ship repair, clusters will be made in 5 states; Maharashtra, Kerela, Andhra Pradesh, Odisha and Gujarat


View: https://x.com/PIB_India/status/1838859613976039895

 

[haldilal]

Both Hero and Bajaj got tech transfer for Engines from their partners.

Hero got that 97cc engine which they worked on and made their version with ~103-104cc output.

Similarly, Bajaj worked on 115cc engine with Kawasaki and improved upon it and had their own iterations later on. They got the engine tech from 390 series engine from KTM and doing their own bikes with the same.​

Ya'll The Hero got more than just a engine, their entire MotoCorp was built on the Honda which lasted for 25 years, unlike the Bajaj who just got engine tech.

 

[Anants]

my roommates used to have boxer and calibre, most of their "innovation" happened after their JV with kawasaki.

funny thing about boxer is that it didn't have a battery, meaning headlight will work only when engine is on. they were competing on price by reduced features with splendour and yamaha.
View attachment 10423

umm not surprising. Scooters were like that. Last self start scooter we had was lambretta IIRC. Most scooters and bikes had dynamos and no battery. Among scooters Kinetic was the first scooter with Button start and automatic gears. Both were considered luxury and kids used to flaunt them to tuitions.

I remember growing up - we had students from African countries coming to study. They bought with them what looked like more advanced moped at that time but with electric start. We kids use to wonder - ohh look no pedal or kick to start Moped - what was norm for Avanti Luna or Bajaj M80.\

Heck scooters were Indicators and two mirrors were seen with same awe as people saw DRL's in the car for first time.

 

[Blademaster]

if this ship building policy works out, IN will be a beneficiary.
=====

Centre in talks with coastal states on shipbuilding clusters in India​

https://www.business-standard.com/i...india-with-coastal-states-124091301393_1.html

In next five years, we will be among the world's top 10 ship builders. For ship building and ship repair, clusters will be made in 5 states; Maharashtra, Kerela, Andhra Pradesh, Odisha and Gujarat


View: https://x.com/PIB_India/status/1838859613976039895

@Brood Father this is something you would never see Congress or Rahul Gandhi capable of pulling this off. They had ten years to do it and they did diddly squat and squandered the next great electronic revolution to China when China stepped up in the smartphone and smart devices game.

 

[Aaj Ka Hero]

Ya'll Flash sales, do large Marketing and advertising of new product, produce limited number of products and create noise about it how it got sold in seconds. this only works in Electronics not in Automobiles.

Nah, release new products in quick succession each two or three months with one engine as a base, focus more on visuals and some really practical equipments like usb-c, bluetooth coupling, bringing electric two wheelers technologies, larger space for luggage than competition, etc.
They used to do these type of quick launches during their venture with honda back in the day.