Maratha Empire

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haldilal

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How could the Maratha Empire be defeated by the British empire when Maratha empire had more men and resources than the British Empire?
 
Blademaster said:
How could the Maratha Empire be defeated by the British empire when Maratha empire had more men and resources than the British Empire?
Click to expand...
One obvious issue was that the Maratha Empire of the time had incorporated European mercenaries into the military as officers. When the going got tough, these officers would abandon their post, and their soldiers would suddenly be fighting without leadership, like headless chickens
 
Blademaster said:
How could the Maratha Empire be defeated by the British empire when Maratha empire had more men and resources than the British Empire?
Click to expand...
By 1802 the British were almost evenly matched with the Marathas in terms of control of territory as the map makes obvious. In addition to this there was no central power in the Maratha Empire.

In fact by that time & for quite a few decades preceding the year mentioned in the map the Marathas had already become a Confederacy with the office of the Peshwa instead of being the central authority now merely reduced to being the first among equals.

To add to it , you had a highly controversial & polarising figure as the last Peshwa who instead of acting as an unifying agent went on to further divide an already divided polity increasing internecine wars which the British exploited to the hilt .

There followed 3 Anglo Maratha wars at the end of which all the Maratha Sardars including the Peshwa had to come to terms with the British with the Peshwa losing his fiefdom & being exiled with a pension while the rest of the Sardars kept theirs while acknowledging the suzerainty of the British which was much more intrusive than the normal suzerain vassal relationship.

It's a long torturous depressing story which I've attempted to explain painting broad strokes.
 
Azaad said:
By 1802 the British were almost evenly matched with the Marathas in terms of control of territory as the map makes obvious. In addition to this there was no central power in the Maratha Empire.

In fact by that time & for quite a few decades preceding the year mentioned in the map the Marathas had already become a Confederacy with the office of the Peshwa instead of being the central authority now merely reduced to being the first among equals.

To add to it , you had a highly controversial & polarising figure as the last Peshwa who instead of acting as an unifying agent went on to further divide an already divided polity increasing internecine wars which the British exploited to the hilt .

There followed 3 Anglo Maratha wars at the end of which all the Maratha Sardars including the Peshwa had to come to terms with the British with the Peshwa losing his fiefdom & being exiled with a pension while the rest of the Sardars kept theirs while acknowledging the suzerainty of the British which was much more intrusive than the normal suzerain vassal relationship.

It's a long torturous depressing story which I've attempted to explain painting broad strokes.
Click to expand...

Good question….. not so good answer above.

In fact the Marathas were poorly organized, badly equipped with guns & artillery and badly lead after their defeat by Ahmad Shah Durrani at the Panipat 3.

The British knew thur paid agents all the Maratha disposition and weaknesses. They set the public against Marathas about “Chauth” (quarter of revenue as tribute). After the British defeated the Marathas, they went back on their terms and imposed 40% taxes and took over the management of the tiny Rajas except the internal affairs. This way the British deceived the public and in turn the rulers who were Marathas.
 
Hari Sud said:
Good question….. not so good answer above.

In fact the Marathas were poorly organized, badly equipped with guns & artillery and badly lead after their defeat by Ahmad Shah Durrani at the Panipat 3.

The British knew thur paid agents all the Maratha disposition and weaknesses. They set the public against Marathas about “Chauth” (quarter of revenue as tribute). After the British defeated the Marathas, they went back on their terms and imposed 40% taxes and took over the management of the tiny Rajas except the internal affairs. This way the British deceived the public and in turn the rulers who were Marathas.
Click to expand...
None of the historians I've read on Maratha history like Jadunath Sarkar or Saradesai or anyone of worth have ever cited lack of proper arms or ammunition or even training as being responsible for Maratha defeat .

In fact the Scindia army was organised equipped & trained on European lines including being staffed by European officers in senior positions much before the Sikhs under Maharaja Ranjit Singh did so no doubt taking a leaf out of the Maratha books which led to them establishing their strong hold in the North including being the real power behind the Mughal Emperor in Delhi post the 3rd War of Panipat.

Even after the demise of Mahadji Scindia the Scindia army continued to be a powerful force in North India although his successors lacked the strategic vision or political acumen of Mahadji Scindia.

Towards the end of the 18th century & beginning 19th century, the Holkars of Indore began re arming under the dynamic leadership of Yashwantrao Holkar who tried to unify his fellow Maratha Sardars as well as other independent Rajas against the British but wasn't entirely successful as he got into a fight with the last Peshwa himself apart from having a cold relationship with the other great power in the Maratha Confederacy - the Scindias.

Eventually the British realised he was a formidable opponent & it was better to have him on their side thus offering him a treaty on magnanimous terms which he accepted . He died an untimely death else who knows what he might have accomplished?!

en.wikipedia.org

Yashwantrao Holkar - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

To conclude, the most salient reasons given for the Marathas failing against the British apart from known facts like disunity among them, mutual suspicion etc was the British valued terms of contract which other native rulers like the Marathas didn't namely paying their soldiers more than what the native rulers paid & much more importantly ON TIME.

Secondly they honoured the terms of contract with their bankers & money lenders encouraging trade , both of which the native rulers had a patchy record in.

Thirdly the lands they controlled were much more fertile like the Bengal Subah ( which included all of WB + BD, Bihar & Odisha) & Awadh thus yielding them more revenue on a per acrage basis as compared to most Indian rulers especially the Marathas.

Let me also add that unlike the native rulers they didn't give a damn to the farmer's plight & extracted revenue come hell or high water which is the reason you saw the maximum number of famines during British rule which by their own accounts took nearly a 100 million lives during the nearly 200 year old rule across the sub continent.

Then there was diplomacy to be considered wherein the British emerged as past masters of the game pursuing divide et impera where they could & wait it out in cases where they couldn't prevail like Yashwantrao Holkar or Maharaja Ranjit Singh offering them friendship & generous terms .

Finally it wasn't the training or the quality of arms & ammunition or even the men which mattered for both sides were evenly matched, it was the leadership & tactics which made a world of difference apart from the reasons outlined above. The British were definitely head & shoulders above all the native powers in diplomacy leadership & military strategy & tactics.

In almost all the wars they fought since the Battle of Plassey & Buxar they were hopelessly outnumbered yet they won almost all the major wars against the major powers of the day that had to be won.

So I'm really not sure where did you get your information from which made you post what you did.
 
This is what various people in History said about Shivaji

Aurangzeb (After Shivaji's death, while reading Namaz)

Never learnt much about Shivaji in history in School. Amazed at what many think of him:

*"From Kabul to Kandahar my Taimur family created the Mogul Sultanate. Iraq, Iran, Turkistan and in many more countries my army defeated ferocious warriors. But in India Shivaji put brakes on us. I spent my maximum energy on Shivaji but could not bring him to his knees.*

*Ya Allah, you gave me an enemy, fearless and upright, please keep your doors to heaven open for him because the world's best and large hearted warrior is coming to you."*

-Shahista Khan.

*"That day Shivaji just didn't chop of my fingers but also chopped off my pride. I fear to meet him even in my dreams."*

Frustrated Begum Ali Adilshah.

*"Is there no man left to defeat Shivaji in my kingdom??"*

- Adolf Hitler

*"Netaji, your country does not require any Hitler to throw out British. All you need to teach is Shivaji's history."*

Lord Mountbatten

*"Had Shivaji been born in England, we would not only have ruled earth but the whole Universe."*

*"Had Shivaji lived for another ten years, the British would not have seen the face of India."*

Netaji

*_If India needs to be made independent then there is only one way out, 'Fight like Shivaji'."*



*"Shivaji is just not a name, it is an energy source for Indian youth, which can be used to make India free."*

- Swami Vivekananda.

*"Had Shivaji been born in America, we would nomenclared him as SUN."*

- Barrack Obama

The famous war of Umberkhind is mentioned in the Guinness Book of World Records:

*"The 30,000 strong army of Kartalab Khan from Uzbekistan was defeated by mere 1000 mawalas of Shivaji. Not a single Uzbeki was left alive to return back home."*

Shivaji was a King of International fame. In the span of 30 yrs of his career he fought with only two Indian warriors. All the others were outsiders.

Shahista Khan, who feared Shivaji even in his dreams was King of Abu Taliban and Turkistan.

Behlol Khan Pathan, Sikandar Pathan, Chidar Khan Pathan were all warrior sardars of Afghanistan.

Diler Khan Pathan was the great warrior of Mangolia. All of them bit dust in front of Shivaji.

Sidhhi Jowhar and Salaba Khan were Iranian warriors, who got defeated by Shivaji.

Sidhhi Jowhar later planned a sea attack. In response Shivaji raised a navy, the first Indian Navy. But before accomplishing the task Shivaji left this world. (He was poisoned.)

Google *"Shivaji, the Management Guru."* It's a full subject in Boston University.

Yet, we Indians know so little about him..... what a pity.... atleast let us make our future generation to know about this great INDIAN🙏
Pl do the least circulate widely.🙏🙏🙏
 
Hari Sud said:
This is what various people in History said about Shivaji

Aurangzeb (After Shivaji's death, while reading Namaz)

Never learnt much about Shivaji in history in School. Amazed at what many think of him:

*"From Kabul to Kandahar my Taimur family created the Mogul Sultanate. Iraq, Iran, Turkistan and in many more countries my army defeated ferocious warriors. But in India Shivaji put brakes on us. I spent my maximum energy on Shivaji but could not bring him to his knees.*

*Ya Allah, you gave me an enemy, fearless and upright, please keep your doors to heaven open for him because the world's best and large hearted warrior is coming to you."*

-Shahista Khan.

*"That day Shivaji just didn't chop of my fingers but also chopped off my pride. I fear to meet him even in my dreams."*

Frustrated Begum Ali Adilshah.

*"Is there no man left to defeat Shivaji in my kingdom??"*

- Adolf Hitler

*"Netaji, your country does not require any Hitler to throw out British. All you need to teach is Shivaji's history."*

Lord Mountbatten

*"Had Shivaji been born in England, we would not only have ruled earth but the whole Universe."*

*"Had Shivaji lived for another ten years, the British would not have seen the face of India."*

Netaji

*_If India needs to be made independent then there is only one way out, 'Fight like Shivaji'."*



*"Shivaji is just not a name, it is an energy source for Indian youth, which can be used to make India free."*

- Swami Vivekananda.

*"Had Shivaji been born in America, we would nomenclared him as SUN."*

- Barrack Obama

The famous war of Umberkhind is mentioned in the Guinness Book of World Records:

*"The 30,000 strong army of Kartalab Khan from Uzbekistan was defeated by mere 1000 mawalas of Shivaji. Not a single Uzbeki was left alive to return back home."*

Shivaji was a King of International fame. In the span of 30 yrs of his career he fought with only two Indian warriors. All the others were outsiders.

Shahista Khan, who feared Shivaji even in his dreams was King of Abu Taliban and Turkistan.

Behlol Khan Pathan, Sikandar Pathan, Chidar Khan Pathan were all warrior sardars of Afghanistan.

Diler Khan Pathan was the great warrior of Mangolia. All of them bit dust in front of Shivaji.

Sidhhi Jowhar and Salaba Khan were Iranian warriors, who got defeated by Shivaji.

Sidhhi Jowhar later planned a sea attack. In response Shivaji raised a navy, the first Indian Navy. But before accomplishing the task Shivaji left this world. (He was poisoned.)

Google *"Shivaji, the Management Guru."* It's a full subject in Boston University.

Yet, we Indians know so little about him..... what a pity.... atleast let us make our future generation to know about this great INDIAN🙏
Pl do the least circulate widely.🙏🙏🙏
Click to expand...


View: https://twitter.com/prathgodbole/status/1810914353467772998?s=19
 
Ya'll The India gone in down spin after Assassination of Pehswa Madhavrao in 1773 by the Aunt, if had survied that Incudent, the history would had been very much different nowadays.
 
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View: https://youtu.be/O-iMSHu3nTk?si=izyYJLT5J-brfY7M

Very interesting & may I add impressive podcast with Dr Uday Kulkarni ex Naval Surgeon turned historian with numerous books to his credit on the Marathas , expounding on the Maratha Confederacy , the prevailing political situation then & before which created circumstances that brought about Chatrapati Shivaji Maharaj whose mission was later continued by his descendants & the Maratha Confederacy to the way it ended & the role played by Raghunathrao aka Raghoba - the younger son of Peshwa Bajirao I & the evil genius whose actions were eventually seen as one of the primary reasons for the downfall of the Confederacy which also happens to be the subject of Dr Uday Kulkarni's latest historical book.
 
Blademaster said:
How could the Maratha Empire be defeated by the British empire when Maratha empire had more men and resources than the British Empire?
Click to expand...

Because Britishers provoked a muslim cleric and told him, see Hindu powers have gained and now Muslim rule is gone. And advice him to write a letter to Ahmed Shah Abdali that come and re establish the rule of Quran in Delhi. Thi prompted Abdali to take fight to India 15 times.

This was a British strategic response to break Durrani empire and Marathas which were the strongest at that time. For nearly 30 years both sides fought eachother and got weaken and then when Britishers saw the time is right, they marched in.

What a maverick shot!
 
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