Indian Politics and Democracy

[crazywithmath]

For people arguing the BJP was any better in terms of freebies. All politicans will push India back to a junk economy. With AI, revenue will slow down.


View: https://x.com/gemsofbabus_/status/1918982468599697453?t=sMMJ2KKvSC9lQtmC7vQRhg&s=19

Debt to GSDP ratio well below permissible limits. Quoted handle (some medic student, apparently) should read budget docs.

 

[Nicky]

Debt to GSDP ratio well below permissible limits. Quoted handle (some medic student, apparently) should read budget docs.

For MP, it's around 30% if I remember. Not too bad for now.

However, idiotic freebies will make the situation worse. Combined with slowdown in economy it will push to higher taxation or higher debt or both.

 

[GaudaNaresh]

Debt to GSDP ratio well below permissible limits. Quoted handle (some medic student, apparently) should read budget docs.

western standards are not standards for permissible limits. Russian standards is. If you want a hardened economy, same with china, we cannot carry western levels of debt.

 

[hit&run]

They are double-dipping resources while ordinary UR Hindus are getting crushed and insulted at the same time.
Hinduism, this way, will die faster than expected.


View: https://x.com/SwarajyaMag/status/1919683947388403959

 

[eastern_bhartiya]

Debt to GSDP ratio well below permissible limits. Quoted handle (some medic student, apparently) should read budget docs.

Annual Budget of 4.21 lakhs and debt being taken is around 5k, why is there so much noise.

They could be rising loan for some other reason

 

[crazywithmath]

western standards are not standards for permissible limits. Russian standards is. If you want a hardened economy, same with china, we cannot carry western levels of debt.

Eh? Who even brought the so-called western standards here?

Indian states are not allowed to maintain a debt to GSDP ratio exceeding 40% - unless explicitly okayed by the union govt. And states need permissions to raise capital from external agencies - which come with a lot of T&Cs. States with poor fiscal health (WB, Punjab, Kerala) are subjected to punitive action (allocation from the union govt are cut down, restrictions on external borrowings/expenditures are imposed etc).

This is by far the fiscally healthiest the republic has ever been - if anything, those Russkies should learn from the GoI.

For MP, it's around 30% if I remember. Not too bad for now.

However, idiotic freebies will make the situation worse. Combined with slowdown in economy it will push to higher taxation or higher debt or both.

No, it won't. Fiscal deficit at 4.7%, debt to GSDP estimated at 31.3% at the end of FY 2025-26. BJP gormints are obsessed with fiscal health, often at electoral perils - there is a reason why those states continue to have excellent fiscal health. Whatever little doles they hand out are effectively canceled out by fiscal consolidation elsewhere.

 

[Nicky]

No, it won't. Fiscal deficit at 4.7%, debt to GSDP estimated at 31.3% at the end of FY 2025-26. BJP gormints are obsessed with fiscal health, often at electoral perils - there is a reason why those states continue to have excellent fiscal health. Whatever little doles they hand out are effectively canceled out by fiscal consolidation elsewhere.

Even if BJP wants to be fiscally prudent, they can't. Either they dole out more freebies to win, or they lose and the opposition comes in and wrecks the economy.

Once you start a race to the bottom which is freebies, there is only one destination, bankruptcy.

 

[crazywithmath]

Even if BJP wants to be fiscally prudent, they can't. Either they dole out more freebies to win, or they lose and the opposition comes in and wrecks the economy.

Once you start a race to the bottom which is freebies, there is only one destination, bankruptcy.

You are acting as if they pioneered pre election freebies. Even before 2019 LS polls there was a massive PM kisan samman nidhi bonanza - what effects did it leave on the fiscal? I do not speculate on economic issues, there have been a battalion of BJP ruled administrations in the past 10 years - the numbers are super clear. The states with poor fiscal health (barring the hill states, whose revenue generating capabilities are limited) are, almost exclusively, ruled by opposition parties.

If anything, they should have done a redo of kisan samman nidhi in the run up to LS 2024 to secure an absolute majority - when a number of indicators were displaying serious stress among the bottom 50% already. They didn't (because, again, these guys are obsessed with fiscal discipline no matter how good their deficit numbers come out to be) and now being forced to moderate their stances on caste census etc.

Morons won't even cut the fuel prices, despite crude reaching historic lows. Like I wrote - obsessed!!!

 

[Nicky]

You are acting as if they pioneered pre election freebies. Even before 2019 LS polls there was a massive PM kisan samman nidhi bonanza - what effects did it leave on the fiscal? I do not speculate on economic issues, there have been a battalion of BJP ruled administrations in the past 10 years - the numbers are super clear. The states with poor fiscal health (barring the hill states, whose revenue generating capabilities are limited) are, almost exclusively, ruled by opposition parties.

If anything, they should have done a redo of kisan samman nidhi in the run up to LS 2024 to secure an absolute majority - when a number of indicators were displaying serious stress among the bottom 50% already. They didn't (because, again, these guys are obsessed with fiscal discipline no matter how good their deficit numbers come out to be) and now being forced to moderate their stances on caste census etc.

Freebies have existed for decades but they have become a critical part of elections in the last few years.

It's easy to dole out freebies, impossible to take them away as people start to think of them as their birthright.

So you are actually arguing for more freebies? They might have worked while the economy was booming, as it starts to slide more, it's a recipe for disaster.

The BJP knows that freebies is the only way to win. Case in point, MP and Maharashtra. So they will be more lose now and as such wreck the economy.

Combine this with more reservations as the economy slides, we are looking at a clusterfuck.

 

[crazywithmath]

Freebies have existed for decades but they have become a critical part of elections in the last few years.

It's easy to dole out freebies, impossible to take them away as people start to think of them as their birthright.

I gave you an example - a pretty big one at that. They did PM kisan samnan nidhi in 2018-19 but had no such scheme in 2024. So yes, it is very much possible to take them away.

So you are actually arguing for more freebies? They might have worked while the economy was booming, as it starts to slide more, it's a recipe for disaster.

When two wheeler sales were faltering, FMCG growth was sliding and I was screaming at an incompetent chutiya administration back on the economy thread of the old DFI there was enough evidence of stress at the bottom of the pyramid. This govt survived covid and recessions with practically zero stimulus - they could have done a targeted programme and it still would not have affected their deficit maths one bit. But instead, they got drunk on the hype they themselves created (muh UPI, muh expressways, muh Vishwagorilla), kept obsessing over fiscal health like a possessed zombie and paid the price.

It does not matter what opinions you hold of stimulus or targeted programmes, it does not matter if you despise them and call them 'freebies' - no political party can ignore the broader political economy.

Those BJPwallahs can continue to remain tone deaf, ignore economic realities, carry on with their obsession over fiscal health and hand over the carefully disciplined fiscal to the opposition parties on a silver plater (a la Karnataka) - or, they can loosen up the purse strings a bit and continue to hold on to the state/LS majority. The choice is theirs.

 

[swesh]

This consagenious marriage data in 2015-16



This is after 2020-21

 

[crazywithmath]

This consagenious marriage data in 2015-16
View attachment 33339


This is after 2020-21
View attachment 33340

Data from NFHS, probably not worth the paper they are printed on.

 

[Nicky]

I gave you an example - a pretty big one at that. They did PM kisan samnan nidhi in 2018-19 but had no such scheme in 2024. So yes, it is very much possible to take them away.



When two wheeler sales were faltering, FMCG growth was sliding and I was screaming at an incompetent chutiya administration back on the economy thread of the old DFI there was enough evidence of stress at the bottom of the pyramid. This govt survived covid and recessions with practically zero stimulus - they could have done a targeted programme and it still would not affect their deficit maths one bit. But instead they got drunk on the hype they themselves created (muh UPI, muh expressways, muh Vishwagorilla), kept obsessing over fiscal health like a possessed zombie and paid the price.

It does not matter what opinions you hold of stimulus or targeted programmes, it does not matter if you despise them and call them 'freebies' - no political party can ignore the broader political economy.

Those BJPwallahs can continue to remain tone deaf, ignore economic realities, carry on with their obsession over fiscal health and hand over the carefully disciplined fiscal to the opposition parties on a silver plater (a la Karnataka) - or, they can loosen up the purse strings a bit and continue to hold on to the state/LS majority. The choice is theirs.

Talk to me when they end the ladli behna in MP or whatever scheme that won them Maharashtra.

What was the free food nonsense during COVID?

It doesn't matter what your opinion is either.

Reservations, slowing economy and freebies is a perfect storm that will devestate the nation in the years to come.

Even the CM admits they are nearing bankruptcy. Isn't this the state with one of the IT capitals?


View: https://x.com/OpIndia_com/status/1919701175630258561?t=jY-lIHTjOVecoZlbLeZWTw&s=19

 

[Suryavanshi]

What was the free food nonsense during COVID?

There are millions in India that would die without rice and wheat sent by gormint. Besides gormint buys grain to control the market prices and it's important to redistribute them to the market or else they middle man will have you buy rice at 300 rs a kg

 

[Nicky]

There are millions in India that would die without rice and wheat sent by gormint. Besides gormint buys grain to control the market prices and it's important to redistribute them to the market or else they middle man will have you buy rice at 300 rs a kg

I'm aware. I was countering the point that we survived Covid without freebies.

Also, why does this still continue?

 

[crazywithmath]

Talk to me when they end the ladli behna in MP or whatever scheme that won them Maharashtra.

That was based. In an ideal world, Shivraj Singh Chauhan would be rewarded for displaying political acumen and catching the winds of political economy when MoSha were drunk on power/arrogance. Too bad, leader Ji started rewarding loyalty over performance quite a while back.

What was the free food nonsense during COVID?

There is a massive supply demand mismatch - we are poducing way way more than what we can eat and the usage of MSPs render them uncompetitive at the international market. The long term solutions are being tried already (gradual reduction in MSP allocations, opening up of agri as a market etc). Distributing them free of cost is an excellent short term fix, what is wrong with that? The crops they are handing out would have;

1. Either rotted at some random godowns,

Or,

2. Offloaded at some local distillery to make alcohol at dirt cheap rates.

It doesn't matter what your opinion is either.

Of course, it doesn't. MoSha can continue to remain tone deaf and believe the hype created by chatukar babus and lamp post ministers. Who am I to stop them?

Reservations, slowing economy and freebies is a perfect storm that will devestate the nation in the years to come.

They likely wouldn't need to moderate their stances on caste census with some pre election freebies and a post election supermajority.

As I wrote, the choice is theirs.

 

[Suryavanshi]

Also, why does this still continue?

The grains they buy must go somewhere, also to control prices like I said previously.

Different Types of Ration Cards in India - A Complete Guide

Different Types of Ration Cards Issued in India – Check Eligibility, Inclusion, and Exclusion of Beneficiaries to Understand NFSA Guidelines on PHH and AAY.

www.bankbazaar.com

Ration scheme is also the most non discriminatory scheme that treat all castes similarly with a bit more special attention to sc st.
It's a very stable scheme serving genuine people in need.
Gormint didn't introduce anything new, this scheme was ongoing before covid and is continued under new name.

In future I see this becoming into something even more robust.

 

[Nicky]

That was based. In an ideal world, Shivraj Singh Chauhan would be rewarded for displaying political acumen and catching the winds of political economy when MoSha were drunk on power/arrogance. Too bad, leader Ji started rewarding loyalty over performance quite a while back.



There is a massive supply demand mismatch - we are poducing way way more than what we can eat and the usage of MSPs render them uncompetitive at the international market. The long term solutions are being tried already (gradual reduction in MSP allocations, opening up of agri as a market etc). Distributing them free of cost is an excellent short term fix, what is wrong with that? The crops they are handing out would have;

1. Either rotted at some random godowns,

Or,

2. Offloaded at some local distillery to make alcohol at dirt cheap rates.



Of course, it doesn't. MoSha can continue to remain tome deaf and believe the hype created by chatukar babus and lamp post ministers. Who am I to stop them?



They likely wouldn't need to moderate their stances on caste census with some pre election freebies and a post election supermajority.

As I wrote, the choice is theirs.

You see freebies as 'political acumen' I see as long term disaster for short term gains. We shall see how it plays out.

Failing to bring farmers in line and calling distribution of free grains that should be exported to earn valuable foreign currency.

MSP itself is a form of freebies which this government has increased due to their political weakness.

Look at Europe to see what happens when freebies continue to grow and the economy slows down.

We are inviting disaster and calling it political acumen.

 

[Nicky]

The grains they buy must go somewhere, also to control prices like I said previously.

Different Types of Ration Cards in India - A Complete Guide

Different Types of Ration Cards Issued in India – Check Eligibility, Inclusion, and Exclusion of Beneficiaries to Understand NFSA Guidelines on PHH and AAY.

www.bankbazaar.com

Ration scheme is also the most non discriminatory scheme that treat all castes similarly with a bit more special attention to sc st.
It's a very stable scheme serving genuine people in need.
Gormint didn't introduce anything new, this scheme was ongoing before covid and is continued under new name.

In future I see this becoming into something even more robust.

It's not the government's job unless you are into socialism.

The government should remove MSP and let excess grain be exported.

 

[crazywithmath]

You see freebies as 'political acumen' I see as long term disaster for short term gains. We shall see how it plays out.

There is no long term 'disaster' in play when the govt is projecting a fiscal deficit of 4.4% and even that is likely a very conservative estimate.

Failing to bring farmers in line and calling distribution of free grains that should be exported to earn valuable foreign currency.

And here, I was trying to take you seriously.

MSPs are considered export subsidies (illegal in global trade). And the crops (wheat etc) are of lower quality that cannot match international products on a competitive market. This is precisely why I wrote that those crops just cannot be exported - in absence of a free food scheme, they will either rot in a godown or be offloaded at distilleries for dirt cheap prices.

Now you can question the MSP system but the incumbent is already moving away from the existing system in a gradual fashion. Crops that are procured outside the purview of PDS/MSP are already exported and not at all affected by the government's free food schemes.

MSP itself is a form of freebies which this government has increased due to their political weakness.

The kind of fact free rubbish you are peddling on a public forum is astounding.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/agriculture-ministry-s-budget-allocation-sees-2-9-cut-output-push-in-100-districts-101738403574171.html

They have been gradually cutting down on agri subsidies and moving in favor of a more open market for quite a while now.

Look at Europe to see what happens when freebies continue to grow and the economy slows down.

We are inviting disaster and calling it political acumen.

How do you expect to be taken seriously with takes like these?