Ghatak UAV/UCAV (1 Viewer)

[125mm_Smoothbore]

For discussions regarding the upcoming stealth flying wind indian UCAV

first flight


recent flight


pics

 

[125mm_Smoothbore]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6v7cCAwMTdQ

 

[SwordOfDarkness]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6v7cCAwMTdQ

If we can get this in short order, we would be fine Air Force wise in short term conflict.

Although without long wavelength radars+stealth fighters our air defence will get screwed in the long term.

 

[125mm_Smoothbore]

View: https://x.com/amanroutray7/status/1819643329430352012

View: https://x.com/amanroutray7/status/1819661147190222922

 

[Ayan Barat]

But don't know why I've this weird feeling that we might be going for two medium sized (built around 2000lbs class PGMs) bomb bays on each side. Somthing similar to Boeing's X-45 line-

View: https://x.com/Ray70409890/status/1873645486055526766?s=19
If I may quote Mirza Ghalib for you @Corvus Splendens
हम हैं मुश्ताक़ और वो बे-ज़ार;
या इलाही ये माजरा क्या है।
हम को उन से वफ़ा की है उम्मीद;
जो नहीं जानते वफ़ा क्या है ।

 

[AGNI 6 ICBM]

Post in thread 'IAF's Future Bomber'

Dec 3, 2024

Is GHATAK enough for future antiship roles ?
Answer is both YES & NO

Above pic shows GHATAK is capable of carrying only 2 antiship missiles in one sortie which is less....


Ghatak is tiny and has limitations bcoz of its weapons bay dimensions and MTOW

So it might not carry BRAHMOS ER & VISHNU HCM ,Which is a big setback.

Weapons which it can carry are

it address today's requirements in both ground attack and antiship role...we might need a new bomber to carry 6-8 ER & VISHNU 🕉 HCM

• AGNI 6 ICBM

• 

Hope this info about ghatak helps

 

[Ayan Barat]

Post in thread 'IAF's Future Bomber'

Dec 3, 2024

Is GHATAK enough for future antiship roles ?
Answer is both YES & NO

Above pic shows GHATAK is capable of carrying only 2 antiship missiles in one sortie which is less....


Ghatak is tiny and has limitations bcoz of its weapons bay dimensions and MTOW

So it might not carry BRAHMOS ER & VISHNU HCM ,Which is a big setback.

Weapons which it can carry are

it address today's requirements in both ground attack and antiship role...we might need a new bomber to carry 6-8 ER & VISHNU 🕉 HCM

• AGNI 6 ICBM

• 

Hope this info about ghatak helps

Are you saying the per bay payload is 1.5t!? I think it's combined payload is 1.5t.
If each bay would be one and a half then your total payload would be 3t...that's bit off for these kind of UCAVs.
X-47B is a 20t MTOW, 65kN UCAV and still you only get 2t of payload. And it's a big UCAV.

No way you're going to fit Nirbhay and Rudram-III in that thing.


I guess GBU-10 type munitions should be the absolute maximum limit.

Pretty much this same scheme is followed in AMCA too. With only difference being you get two additional AAM capability (total additional payload of roughly 500kg) over the bomb capacity of Ghatak.

 

[AGNI 6 ICBM]

Are you saying the per bay payload is 1.5t!? I think it's combined payload is 1.5t.
If each bay would be one and a half then your total payload would be 3t...that's bit off for these kind of UCAVs.
X-47B is a 20t MTOW, 65kN UCAV and still you only get 2t of payload. And it's a big UCAV.
View attachment 20235
No way you're going to fit Nirbhay and Rudram-III in that thing.
View attachment 20236
View attachment 20237
I guess GBU-10 type munitions should be the absolute maximum limit.

Pretty much this same scheme is followed in AMCA too. With only difference being you get two additional AAM capability (total additional payload of roughly 500kg) over the bomb capacity of Ghatak.

X47B wing design and ghatak wing design are different....

Boeing phantom ray's design comes closer to DRDO ghatak's wing design....

The developers say boeing phantom can carry ~2.1 Ton payload...with 48 kn dry f404 ....built in 2010's
IMO Ghatak might carry ~2.1+ Ton with 52+ Kn Ton dry kaveri in ~2026

Ghatak is bigger than phantom in dimensions but lighter than MTOW...Indicates higher payload/range

Big IWB points towards ability/necessity to carry big payloads

 

[randombully]

Nagging

View: https://x.com/alpha_defense/status/1889347390278418599

 

[darkflame]

X47B wing design and ghatak wing design are different....

Boeing phantom ray's design comes closer to DRDO ghatak's wing design....
View attachment 20528
The developers say boeing phantom can carry ~2.1 Ton payload...with 48 kn dry f404 ....built in 2010's
IMO Ghatak might carry ~2.1+ Ton with 52+ Kn Ton dry kaveri in ~2026

Ghatak is bigger than phantom in dimensions but lighter than MTOW...Indicates higher payload/range

Big IWB points towards ability/necessity to carry big payloads View attachment 20529

We better make a larger optionally manned variant of ghatak with 3 full fledged kaveri engines with an mtow of around 30-35 tons to take on Chinese j36.

 

[randombully]

We better make a larger optionally manned variant of ghatak with 3 full fledged kaveri engines with an mtow of around 30-35 tons to take on Chinese j36.

Bhai kuch aur mat bol

 

[Corvus Splendens]

 

[Pundit Pikachu]

Swift UCAV Brochure Ffrom Aero India 2023





FEATURES
Powerplant : Turbofan Engine
Range : 250 Km (LOS)
Take Off / Landing : Automatic Take Off & Landing at 70 m/sec
Wing Span : 5 m
Speed : 0.6 Mach (Cruise)
Hard points : 2 points ca pable of carrying 2x50 Kg stores/ CMDS
Flight Mode : Command, Autonomous & Get-To-Home feature
MaxAUW : 1100 Kg

 

[randombully]

Concept:- tactical heavy unmanned flying wing powered by two dry kaveri engine, differents varients configured for different roles based on one common platform.

Varients:- first, ISR varients.

1,ISTAR.
2, maritime surveillance.
3, SIGNIT &comjam/EW.
All will be highly survivability in contested enviornment compared to current non stealth systems.



Second, Strike varient/ tactical unmanned bomber drone/standoff munitions platform.

Can be operated by both IAF and IN.

Specs for strike varient:- design is made to prioritise lift and endurance, hence more wider length to width ratio then ucavs like S-70 Okhotnik-B, ghatak under development etc, also would allow it to have lot higher range, payload than like of s70 while only have 25% more max thrust, but at the cost of high speed performance.



Length:- 15-17 meters.
Wingspan:- 25+ meters.
Height:- 4+ meters.
Mtow:- 25+ tons.
Fuel capacity:- ~10tons.
Power plant:- 2 dry kaveri( ~100kn total max dry thrust).
Combat radius :- 2000+km.
Ferry range:- 4000+km.
Cruise speed- 0.6-0.7 mach.
Max Altitude:- 50k+ feet.
Endurance:-6 to 8 hours.

Now for payload, it should be able to carry 4tons of payload( internal weapons bay) with it's size, design and powerplant.
But I envision it's iwb to be on relatively larger size realtive to its size, to carry longer( not necessarly heavier) stand off munitions like rudram series missiles, cruise missiles, anti ship missiles, smaller quasi ballistic missiles, large awacs killer missiles etc.

Drone having two iwb in side by side configuration, each iwb ~7 meters in length, 3 meters width, 1meter depth.
This will be tricky, but entirely possible to design and accommodate this iwb.

Along with that, it can also share data and act as sensor extenders for fighter jets, like like loyal wingman,

By now we have all the tech needed to biuld this drone, except the engine, which is under final stages of certification to be used on ghatak drone.

With the capabilities and needs and gaps it will fulfill, it will future proof the iaf to a very high extent.


And my fantasy ends here.

But honestly it's a low hanging fruit, which if gov. Is willing to invest money into it is technologically highly feasible given how much we progressed and will greatly exchanges our capabilities.
We won't even need to develop new technologies, the ones we are developing for ghatak and amca can be scaled to suit Maha ghatak.

Both china and US are also developing large /huge(for a drone) flying wing ucavs for ISR purposes.

 

[liberalredditor]

using 2 k9 kaveri would be brilliant, it would be able to carry all the future cruise missile and heavy bombs too
but till the time it comes, we will have 85kn kaveri, so it can be used,

 

[randombully]

But I think it's a serious force multiplyer and a project we should not miss.
Even if bomber varient is not made.
Istar, maritime surveillance, signit comjam are the force multiplyers that we are getting now but on a "non stealth" large platforms.
Moving these to a stealthy large 30 ton flying wing platform will future proof these "important force multiplyers".

@Bhartiya Sainik

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

But I think it's a serious force multiplyer and a project we should not miss.
Even if bomber varient is not made.
Istar, maritime surveillance, signit comjam are the force multiplyers that we are getting now but on a "non stealth" large platforms.
Moving these to a stealthy large 30 ton flying wing platform will future proof these "important force multiplyers".

@Bhartiya Sainik

So you wan't to combine Ghatak & ISTAR?
May be 6gen's aim is also something like that for a fighter. Time'll tell soon.
It sounds futuristic but there're some natural constraints.

In 5gen both sides wan't to detect others DIRECTLY by their own sensors, but still remain undetected.
In 6gen both sides wan't to detect others INDIRECTLY by sensors of other assets & remain undetected.
But this is strategy for combat fighters.
The AWACS/JSTARS/AEW&C/ISTAR jets constitute the "other assets" which are detectable but protected at large distance.

But VLR-SAMs like S-400 (40N6E) & VLR-AAMs like Novator KS-172, R-37, PL-17, AIM-174B want to hit targets at 400 Km+/-
So the goal of AWACS becomes to detect targets beyond that range, which needs high electric power & RF radiation by antennas bigger than fighter radars. So even if they use AESA & LPI, i think their RF radiation'll be detected at long distance. Sono use of stealth.

The AWACS is analogous to those WW era big search lights to spot aircrafts.

 

[randombully]

So you wan't to combine Ghatak & ISTAR?
May be 6gen's aim is also something like that for a fighter. Time'll tell soon.
It sounds futuristic but there're some natural constraints.

In 5gen both sides wan't to detect others DIRECTLY by their own sensors, but still remain undetected.
In 6gen both sides wan't to detect others INDIRECTLY by sensors of other assets & remain undetected.
But this is strategy for combat fighters.
The AWACS/JSTARS/AEW&C/ISTAR jets constitute the "other assets" which are detectable but protected at large distance.

But VLR-SAMs like S-400 (40N6E) & VLR-AAMs like Novator KS-172, R-37, PL-17, AIM-174B want to hit targets at 400 Km+/-
So the goal of AWACS becomes to detect targets beyond that range, which needs high electric power & RF radiation by antennas bigger than fighter radars. So even if they use AESA & LPI, i think their RF radiation'll be detected at long distance. Sono use of stealth.

The AWACS is analogous to those WW era big search lights to spot aircrafts.

You can switch off the radar if you detect a missile coming, you can't switch off big ass rcs.
Plus a bomber varient that can carry standoff munitions like rundram 3 in its iwb, and still can get close to border or even cross it for deeper( 500 inside enemy
territory) strike inside enemy territory.
Also maritime anti ship role.

Also this.

China unveils CH-7 drone with 85-foot wingspan, 575 mph speed

New images emerge of China's CH-7 Long-Endurance Drone that seem to indicate it undergoing testing in readiness for completion.

interestingengineering.com

And this.

RQ-180

See the latest RQ-180 stories from The War Zone. See news, trends, tips, reviews and more at The War Zone.

www.twz.com

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

You can switch off the radar if you detect a missile coming, you can't switch off big ass rcs.

With AESA multi-beams, radar doesn't need to be switched off.
When a missile is detected, it has to be tracked continiously to see if it is still homing or lost the target.

The ISTAR jet can also try all types of EW, DIRCM & even DEW, which i think might be less costly than using RAS, RAM.
Although i agree giving some geometric treatment to ISTAR bcoz that alone reduces RCS a lot. So either ADA should design & HAL should make it, otherwise Embraer, Bombardier, Gulfstream, SAAB, etc would have to be contacted.

The ISTAR jets have fighter escorts & SAMs around them, so incoming VLR-SAMs/AAMs could be downed.

The VLR-SAMs & AAMs currently have 400 Km range.
Suppose, if ISTAR can stay 500 Km away from border & detetct targets at 600-800 Km, that's 100-300Km beyond border, then it's enough. No stealth needed & money is saved.
If a stealth jet somehow manages sneaks 100-150 Km into our area & launches VLR-AAM, then also it could be downed, jammed.

Plus a bomber varient that can carry standoff munitions like rundram 3 in its iwb, and still can get close to border or even cross it for deeper( 500 inside enemy

territory) strike inside enemy territory.
Also maritime anti ship role.

We can't handle AMCA on time, you want a B-21 like bomber with telephone pole sized Rudram-3?
Its CAPEX & OPEX would be very high.
If we can't tame a buffalo, how can we expect an elephant?



We have handled Pakistan easily.
But AFAIK, our doctrine with China is not going deep there but just defend Ladakh & Arunachal Pradesh, bcoz crossing border is considered major escalation. Then China will get free hand reasons to strike deep in India, which will be a disaster as Chine leads us technically & numerically.
Hence after Naval Tu-22 we didn't go for bomber.

I said before many times that i personally don't believe in a UCAV which can't defend itself once/if detected.

A big boomerang shaped jet like B-21 is a big technical risk. But USA can take it bcoz -
- it is decades ahead of its adversaries in R&D.
- it has entire ecosystem of MIC.
- it has its own global bases.
- it has global allies.
- it has global market.

China would attack West in Pacific - Guam, Hawai, SE Asian allies, Australia. Hence it is making J-36 & B-21 like H-20 bomber.

We have supersonic .
We're researching on hypersonic missiles.
So we can use IRBMs with different guidance & terminal seekers for different targets.
We can make subsonic cruise missiles also.

Also this.

China unveils CH-7 drone with 85-foot wingspan, 575 mph speed

New images emerge of China's CH-7 Long-Endurance Drone that seem to indicate it undergoing testing in readiness for completion.

interestingengineering.com

And this.

RQ-180

See the latest RQ-180 stories from The War Zone. See news, trends, tips, reviews and more at The War Zone.

www.twz.com

The future is of drones, so all types will be eventually made, but funding with time for different programs have to be prioritized.

USA is literally world police & China is expansionist, & both are heading towards conflict due to Taiwan & South China Sea, hence they need all types of platforms & weapons.

Our situation is not that severe.

However, i said earlier that these boomerangs are suited for subsonic tasks like recon, EW, expendable patrol, etc. So with a suitable engine with enough electricity, EW, recon drones can be made.
But AWACS/JSTARS/ISTAR capability needs far more electricity.

 

[Azaad]

Get the Ghatak certified ASAP & then get down to design your own B-21 equipped with 4 KED TF with each delivering the same ~ 50 KN dry KED or tweak them to deliver 60 KN dry vide another program since we require a 100 KN to replace the F-414 during the MLU of the LCA Mk-2 in any case.

Please do note if we go in for the 60 KN option things would be delayed else we can get our B-21 equivalent in the air with 4x ~50 KN KED by the late 2030s . Should be good enough to cover the whole of China & the IOR .

We don't have ambitions beyond that as of now & for the foreseeable future.

However, i said earlier that these boomerangs are suited for subsonic tasks like recon, EW, expendable patrol, etc. So with a suitable engine with enough electricity, EW, recon drones can be made.
But AWACS/JSTARS/ISTAR capability needs far more electricity.