Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

[GaudaNaresh]

View: https://x.com/SanUvacha/status/1922028216010920205

we will be better baniya than them, just like Israel is and we will scavenge what WE think is fit for us to eat.
If any yankee ever wonders about selling offensive weapons and platforms to India- come back to this video why we say 'lulz no. we will get frog shit or vodka shit or make our own or go without. but not sink money into your shit'.
What we will scavenge out of them, is the P8I and all the itty bitty listerner/intel stuff- thats the stuff they cant really stop us from using except for refuse routine servicing after 1000-2000 hours, which is much different than combat servicing- replacing parts after hot manuevers and few sorties in a few days scenarios.
Okie dokie, we fight today, we stop and then we have 3 more years to wait out trumpwa or apply maskaa again to get p8i routine serviced. No problemo.

We will buy shit from them, but only shit that is not offensive platforms. Yankees at this point need to just stop wasting their time and our time trying to get us to buy shit we will never ever buy from them.
This ravan is not getting this sita and i dont think ravan was duffer enough to stick around for 40 years to try getting sita to cross lakhsmanrekha and sita arguing back from behind it.

 

[pipebomb]

India should only buy platforms it could afford to loose because attrition will be a reality of Indo pak engagement. And even more so in case of indo-china.

Two questions

- could IAF had pulled off Operation Sindoor with super su-30s & lca mkii and without rafales ?
Ans: Yes

- could IAF had pulled off op Sindoor without BrahMos, scalp, ROCK, rampage etc. ?
Ans: probably not

It's what you put on your platform which is equally if not more important than the platform. Imagine su-30 with aesa and astra mk3 combo, how deadly it would be

 

[shade2]

View: https://x.com/SanUvacha/status/1922028216010920205

Since liberalization various Govt have been in power, but none of these Govt have purchased large amounts of front-line combat platforms like Jets, Tanks, IFVs, Ships from these Amerisharts and for very good reason.

Nothing is getting "torpedoed", nobody is going to buy large amounts of Amerishart gear from there anyway.

ST reservation enjoyers running 2 accounts on this thread also kang about F-35 purchase but Dolund will not sell that to us directly, he will insist we buy F-16/F-15 first.

 

[silentassassin265]

India should only buy platforms it could afford to loose because attrition will be a reality of Indo pak engagement. And even more so in case of indo-china.

Two questions

- could IAF had pulled off Operation Sindoor with super su-30s & lca mkii and without rafales ?
Ans: Yes

- could IAF had pulled off op Sindoor without BrahMos, scalp, ROCK, rampage etc. ?
Ans: probably not

It's what you put on your platform which is equally if not more important than the platform. Imagine su-30 with aesa and astra mk3 combo, how deadly it would be

Only rafales have scalp missile which was necessary for this
Using su30 we could've dropped bramhos but it would've gave bigger RCS.
Still it would've been better choice as countermeasures on su30 are tried and tested.
IAF for some reason always preferred french jets even when they have no proven countermeasures

 

[pipebomb]

Only rafales have scalp missile which was necessary for this
Using su30 we could've dropped bramhos but it would've gave bigger RCS.
Still it would've been better choice as countermeasures on su30 are tried and tested.
IAF for some reason always preferred french jets even when they have no proven countermeasures

By getting hung up on Scalp you're missing the point of my comment. Forget scalp pick any air launched cruise missile

RCS in not a big factor in standoff deployment

 

[randombully]

By getting hung up on Scalp you're missing the point of my comment. Forget scalp pick any air launched cruise missile

RCS in not a big factor in standoff deployment

Yup, scalp is relatively lot more easy to intercept Than brahmos.
Scalp being Low observable is lot harder to deal with than traditional subsonic cruise missiles, but it's not in direct competition with supersonic or faster missiles.
Subsonic cruise missiles rely on relatively more number and being realtively cheaper than supersonic/or faster missiles.
Being a low part of high low mix.

Second, stealth cruise missiles, are ***not*** technically stealth, they are low observable., because you don't apply expensive fighter jet level RAM/RAS material/paint on them, because that will require constant relatively expensive mantinence, and will also make their acquisition cost more expensive.
Plus they typically do terrain hugging and generally are intercepted at closer distance( WVR level), so fighter level stealth ain't gonna help them much in this range, especially due to highly sensitive modern IR and EO sensors.

So giving them "more stealth" using stealth fighter level RAM/RAS, besides shaping and using composites is not worth it.

But general public due to not having this knowledge has overhyped "stealth subsonic cruise missiles" a lot, now again they are not bad but overhyped.

 

[Gandaberunda]

By getting hung up on Scalp you're missing the point of my comment. Forget scalp pick any air launched cruise missile

RCS in not a big factor in standoff deployment

Well you analysis is correct but Rafale gives us that first shoot advantage and air superiority. As of now in our inventory we have mirage2k MiG 29 Rafale Su30 and jaguars.
In future we will have Tejas MK1A and Tejas MK2 indigenous cheaply built platforms. MK2 will be work horse of IAF and used for both A2A and A2S missions taking over mirage and Mig29 roles. We can use them without worrying about attrition. Rafales will be sparsely used like how we use Mirages now.

 

[shade2]

Only rafales have scalp missile which was necessary for this
Using su30 we could've dropped bramhos but it would've gave bigger RCS.
Still it would've been better choice as countermeasures on su30 are tried and tested.
IAF for some reason always preferred french jets even when they have no proven countermeasures

Deshi equivalent of SCALP missile is called CATS Hunter, it seems sem2sem, air launched cruise missile with low observable, boxy shape with terrain hugging flight



Below is a mock up from some Aero India

 

[randombully]

Deshi equivalent of SCALP missile is called CATS Hunter, it seems sem2sem, air launched cruise missile with low observable, boxy shape with terrain hugging flight

View attachment 35645

Below is a mock up from some Aero India

View attachment 35646

Na, cats hunter has evolved.
It's design, it's subsystems, softwares, capabilities are to be next gen, to be In same class and as advance as other stealth cruise missile/autonomous drones that will enter service in similar time frame in future.

Scalp in comparison is "not more advance" than our LR-LACM except in having low observable shape( also in different weight and range class).

 

[shade2]

India seeks additional S-400 missile defence systems from Russia: Sources

After the S-400's successful performance during Operation Sindoor, India has reportedly requested more such units from Russia to bolster its air defence.

www.indiatoday.in

More s400 systems to be purchased, hope this isn't true, Dalals will make sure Project Kusha doesn't see light of day and these Ruskals can't deliver existing orders, where will they deliver new ones

 

[shade2]

su-30 with Air Launched





from here


View: https://x.com/CharlieVertical/status/1922256678860279874

 

[randombully]

India seeks additional S-400 missile defence systems from Russia: Sources

After the S-400's successful performance during Operation Sindoor, India has reportedly requested more such units from Russia to bolster its air defence.

www.indiatoday.in

More s400 systems to be purchased, hope this isn't true, Dalals will make sure Project Kusha doesn't see light of day and these Ruskals can't deliver existing orders, where will they deliver new ones

It's a order for more missiles used in s400, not new systems.
Which is typical, especially after using some of those missiles recently.

 

[pipebomb]

Na, cats hunter has evolved.
It's design, it's subsystems, softwares, capabilities are to be next gen, to be In same class and as advance as other stealth cruise missile/autonomous drones that will enter service in similar time frame in future.
View attachment 35654
Scalp in comparison is "not more advance" than our LR-LACM except in having low observable shape( also in different weight and range class).

Russian are doing something very interesting with ALCM deployment



If you think about it b-52/tu-95 does something very similar but with bigger ALCM and nukes

 

[silentassassin265]

Well you analysis is correct but Rafale gives us that first shoot advantage and air superiority. As of now in our inventory we have mirage2k MiG 29 Rafale Su30 and jaguars.
In future we will have Tejas MK1A and Tejas MK2 indigenous cheaply built platforms. MK2 will be work horse of IAF and used for both A2A and A2S missions taking over mirage and Mig29 roles. We can use them without worrying about attrition. Rafales will be sparsely used like how we use Mirages now.

After kargil war IAF lost confidence in Russian platforms and started buying western one.
Honestly russian platforms su30 and mig 29 gives us much more freedom allowing us to integrate local,israeli, russian and western subsystem.
We will never be able to integrate anything in rafale except french weapons.
Should've gone for su57

 

[randombully]

Russian are doing something very interesting with ALCM deployment
View attachment 35675View attachment 35676
View attachment 35680

If you think about it b-52/tu-95 does something very similar but with bigger ALCM and nukes

It's a cheap low obersbable smart standoff munition, many countries are developing similar ones, the only difference being this "look" more like a stealthy cruise missile( again the boundary between subsonic cruise missiles and drones/ smart stand off munitions are being erased).
What's impressive though is its assesed range of ~600km in this relatively small size, but sacrifice in speed had to be made.

 

[RocketMan]

Hi Sameer, great thoughts and I echo that but I see another kinetic action by 2030 and very few machines are there which can give us numbers and can be quickly assimilated..
We have really dug a hole for ourselves on fighter squadrons.
1. Can't buy new M2K, Mig29 and Jags - out of production except for mothballed Mig29s in Russia
2. Can't order more LCA due to engine constraints at GE
3. Can't order Su30, Su47 due to Katsa
4. Not sure if we can trust Unkil with F-35, F16 etc.

The only guaranteed thing right now is Rafale.

Missile maxxing it is then , best bang for buck for us

 

[midnight]

If we buy offensive American equipment we won't have neighbourly problems.
If we buy the Boeing F15 ex we will have 6th gen connections.

 

[midnight]

If we buy offensive American equipment we won't have neighbourly problems.
If we buy the Boeing F15 ex we will have 6th gen connections.

@Anants kindly explain what is so funny?

 

[Kapil]

Missile maxxing it is then , best bang for buck for us

Yes,
If we have to do maxing on some Surface to Surface rockets/missiles, it should be :

1. Pinaka - 90kms and more extended range systems

2. Prahar/Pranash - I am not sure what it's utility will be once we get Pinaka with more than 150km range, but maybe quasi-ballistic short range missile with 0.5-1 t payload?

3. Pralay - absolutely our tip of the spear. All the hoopla about HQ9 intercepting hypersonic projectiles will die down once we send this with flowers

4. BMos - I don't think anyone has doubts about it now

And I am not even going to SFC

 

[Spitfire IX]

After kargil war IAF lost confidence in Russian platforms and started buying western one.
Honestly russian platforms su30 and mig 29 gives us much more freedom allowing us to integrate local,israeli, russian and western subsystem.
We will never be able to integrate anything in rafale except french weapons.
Should've gone for su57

Developed Rafale existed. Developed Su-57 didn't.

The low number of Su-57 produced raises questions to me over its procurement by India. Buying a stopgap for a delayed AMCA does not makes sense if the stopgap itself is subject to delay.

Better to get one's head out of the sand and actually do something that will bring about timely Tejas Mk2 production IMO.