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discussion at DFI had moved ahead on this topic of where that post from team BHP is at the moment.
this discussion is incomplete without taking into account R&D financing conversion rate,
conversion rate between financing --> R&D funding --> intellectual property --> commercial viability --> commercial application --> sales --> Return of Investment.
this conversion rate is not 1:1. if a company invests in 100 intellectual properties, only a few might give commercial returns. cost of bad returns will be recovered from the ones with commercial sales.
if business people(some not all) saw commercial benefit in funding R&D, more of them would be doing it.
do they have comments on this aspect?
since BOSCH was mentioned, which is a german company, let's compare central bank repo rates between two countries. companies have to fund R&D either with loans, equity or cash reserves.
now the situation is a little better, but earlier outside of a few biggies hardly any company had cheap funds to spend on R&D.
this discussion is incomplete without taking into account R&D financing conversion rate,
conversion rate between financing --> R&D funding --> intellectual property --> commercial viability --> commercial application --> sales --> Return of Investment.
this conversion rate is not 1:1. if a company invests in 100 intellectual properties, only a few might give commercial returns. cost of bad returns will be recovered from the ones with commercial sales.
if business people(some not all) saw commercial benefit in funding R&D, more of them would be doing it.
do they have comments on this aspect?
since BOSCH was mentioned, which is a german company, let's compare central bank repo rates between two countries. companies have to fund R&D either with loans, equity or cash reserves.
now the situation is a little better, but earlier outside of a few biggies hardly any company had cheap funds to spend on R&D.
To all generol haters ,unfortunately even aam janata is happy with foreign maal. Desi baniyas ( business men irrespective of caste ) are happy with screwdrivergiri and fooling masses with talks of indegionous tech.
"Our Indian manufacturers have grown up and building their own engines. They do need to work with companies like AVL as they have time-tested advanced simulation environments."
Hopium copium devoid of facts , just like license manufacturing Russian engines don't make HAL IP owners or give them expertise for clean state design e.g the Tejas saga ( along with Kaveri engine troubles ) since 1990s.
Detractors of my reasoning will have to prove (for any quality discussion) how much ip tata /Mahindra actually own or have self developed etc wrt ice technology.
"Bosch builds electronics which are used by literally every manufacturer. These devices can be built by others, but Bosch has proven reliability over the years. It is best to use the product from their factory."
If the comparision is with western automotive manufacturers ,yes they too use technology from others but they on their own hold many patents ( that are useful and have been incorporated into production models) in key technology areas
e g Benz using technology from Bosch
Mercedes-Benz and Bosch driverless parking system: Approved for commercial use | Mercedes-Benz Group
Mercedes-Benz and Bosch have reached an important milestone on the way to automated driving: Germany’s Federal Motor Transport Authority (KBA) has approved their highly automated parking system for use in the P6 parking garage run by APCOA at Stuttgart Airport.group.mercedes-benz.com
But then consider the technical ip that Benz holds by itself
"On January 29, 1886, Carl Benz registered a patent for a “vehicle powered by a gaseous fuel engine.” Since then, we have refined automobiles with more than 114,000 patent applications and developed numerous pioneering innovations. Our current focus involves the CASE technologies."
Intellectual Property protects our ideas — and freedom to act | Mercedes-Benz Group
On January 29, 1886, Carl Benz registered a patent for a “vehicle powered by a gaseous fuel engine.” Since then, we have refined automobiles with more than 114,000 patent applications and developed numerous pioneering innovations. Our current focus involves the CASE technologies.
Unless we accept the facts what we are lacking in key areas and acknowledge that we depend on other advanced economies for critical technologies , how are we going to develop those on our own?
Safety quality and research these are the basic tenets required for us to develop key technologies, unfortunately private sector and our society as a whole don't take the three aspects seriously.
e.g safety/quality - cough syruph contamination, fda notice to pharma manufacturers , people tried to paint it as a conspiracy by westerners , instead of getting to the root cause and rectifying it.
"For Manu Saale to quit Mercedes and work for Mahindra, it would have to be a very sweet deal."
A single leader will help but more importantly we should create the ecosystem , private companies willing to invest heavily in research, researchers getting good career prospects.
"But BEML is developing an indigenous 1500 HP engine for military vehicles though."
regarding that I have already wrote here , for the interested dig into technology tranfer from tetra bamer polish company to beml hanging fire since 90s.
"Tata/Mahindra/Bajaj/Hero/Royal Enfield/TVS etc leaning on specialist firms is a no-brainer because such firms spend a significant amount of R&D on engine development. After all, it is their only business. So for a relatively small fee, Indian companies will get access to the best ICE technology. They can then focus on what really matters for Tata/Mahindra/Bajaj - which is overall product development."
With all due respect - true baniya speak, this is what makes indian companies to import api in bulk from china to manufacture medicine ( whose basic research was done by foreign pharma firms ) and then make tall claims of being pharmacy to world.
This tall claim was stress tested when usa stopped critical inputs for Oxford vaccine ( which was misleadingly presented as indigenous vaccine from SII), don't take my opinion as negative ,but we have to criticise our current practises so that we improve and become technologically independent.
"we see this specialization phenomenon more prominently in aircraft engines. Whether it is Boeing or Airbus or Embraer or COMAC,"
Very good to compare tata, Mahindra with Boeing or Airbus but as mentioned in the case with Bosch/Benz do try to grasp the fact that Boeing and Airbus on their own are leaders in key aviation technology, that they developed in house.
We can take this in rage and try to shout and claim we are number one in technology or we can do a calm analysis of the facts, dig deeper and accept shortcomings where identified and acknowledge our dependece on Western technology and then take necessary measures to overcome them .
