Chinese Air Force

[E-195]

The J36 was motivated by the need for a large amount of electricity rather than thrust,

and will be replaced by a variable cycle engine in the future.

how you will generate the electricity? obviously the 3rd engine is running.

You will need to spend fuel to generate electricity, to generate electricity you need move the turbine, then you spend fuel.

Obviously J-36 is or very heavy to achieve long range and high payload but likely they have no good engines now use logic electricity needs movement, how you get the movement? with fuel fuel fuel, more fuel more weight

 

[helin]

how you will generate the electricity? obviously the 3rd engine is running.

You will need to spend fuel to generate electricity, to generate electricity you need move the turbine, then you spend fuel.

Obviously J-36 is or very heavy to achieve long range and high payload but likely they have no good engines now use logic electricity needs movement, how you get the movement with fuel fuel fuel, more fuel more weight

This is a 60-ton plane,

It carries a lot of fuel

 

[E-195]

This is a 60-ton plane,

It carries a lot of fuel

do you understahd what is thermal efficiency for a jet engine?

Less efficient more fuel spent, if NGAd does it with 2 engines carrying less fuel then that aircraft is no fighter but a tactical bomber.

 

[helin]

do you understahd what is thermal efficiency for a jet engine?

Less efficient more fuel spent, if NGAd does it with 2 engines carrying less fuel then that aircraft is no fighter but a tactical bomber.

Where is NGAd?

How can we discuss it without a picture

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

This is a 60-ton plane,

It carries a lot of fuel

60 tons???
Is that MTOW or STOW (Stealth Take Off Weight)?

 

[helin]

60 tons???
Is that MTOW or STOW (Stealth Take Off Weight)?

The potential MTOW of the J-36 could be from 50 tons to 60 tons

Chengdu J-36: Analysis of China’s 6th-Gen Fighter Aircraft

On 26 December 2024, China surprised the world by flying two new prototypes of its sixth-generation fighter aircraft, the Chengdu J-36 and Shenyang J-XX/J-50.

quwa.org

 

[E-195]

Where is NGAd?

How can we discuss it without a picture

The prototypes have flown, what do you think the USA wants to advertise everything like CCP?

They are going to release pictures when ever they want, they flew their aircraft in 2021.

But is highly unlikely it has 3 engines since B-21 is twin engined what suggests they have powerful enough engines

 

[helin]

The prototypes have flown, what do you think the USA wants to advertise everything like CCP?

They are going to release pictures when ever they want, they flew their aircraft in 2021.

But is highly unlikely it has 3 engines since B-21 is twin engined what suggests they have powerful enough engines

Shenyang j-50 has taken off.

It has two engines.

There's video to see it

 

[helin]

J-50 2 engine

J-36 3 engine

H-20 4 engine


They have different uses

 

[rockdog]

That's right,

The J36 will not be Mach 3

Yes, u r right, J36 is a new thing, not like F22 who defined 5th gen, now J36 would make some definition of 6th gen.

People from our aviation community are debating there are 2 turbo fan + 1 ramjet or 2 ramjet + 1 turbo fan.



Maybe there won't be any dog fighter for siexer any more.

 

[E-195]

Shenyang j-50 has taken off.

It has two engines.

There's video to see it

that is not proof the USA has not flown it.

 

[helin]

that is not proof the USA has not flown it.

Yes, I believe it's true.

But there was too little information to discuss, except for a short piece of news.

 

[E-195]

Yes, I believe it's true.

But there was too little information to discuss, except for a short piece of news.

correct but B-21 very likely has 2 engines, since the engines are derivatives of F135

Interactive Graphic: Design Features Likely on The B-21 Raider | Aviation Week Network

A microcutaway of what we think we know about features on the U.S. Air Force’s next stealth bomber.

aviationweek.com

 

[helin]

correct but B-21 very likely has 2 engines, since the engines are derivatives of F135

View attachment 21173


View attachment 21174

Interactive Graphic: Design Features Likely on The B-21 Raider | Aviation Week Network

A microcutaway of what we think we know about features on the U.S. Air Force’s next stealth bomber.

aviationweek.com

But it's only Mach 0.8

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

Yes, u r right, J36 is a new thing, not like F22 who defined 5th gen, now J36 would make some definition of 6th gen.

People from our aviation community are debating there are 2 turbo fan + 1 ramjet or 2 ramjet + 1 turbo fan.

View attachment 21165

Maybe there won't be any dog fighter for siexer any more.

View attachment 21166

The infographic looks nice but it is just symbolic, not to scale. And it is obviously 1 sided. So it becomes very difficult to be realistic. The Western opponent shown here may not approach like depcited.
And BVR-AAMs can miss their targets due to tactics, jamming, decoys, etc.

Now after revealing of B-21 & J-36, it is tme for manned fighter jets & UCAVs. USA will be compelled to reveal their NGAD system soon.

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

Notional NGAD Vs J-36

 

[E-195]

But it's only Mach 0.8

speed is not due to engine thrust, but intake geometry, fixed intakes reduce thrust to the engine once they go beyond their design mach number, plus acceleration will be related to drag and thrust available.

B-21 is a dedicated bomber and is heavier, J-36 is supposedly a fighter, NGAD will use 2 engines and same the European aircraft, so very likely chinese engine technology is behind

 

[E-195]

Notional NGAD Vs J-36

View attachment 21200

Airbus A300-600 versus McDonnell-Douglas DC-10-30
54.10 m 177 ft 6 in length 55.50 m 182 ft 1 in
44.84 m 147 ft 1 in wingspan 50.40 m 165 ft 4 in
260.00 m2 2,799 ft2 wingarea 367.70 m2 3,958 ft2
16.50 m 54 ft 2 in height 17.70 m 58 ft 1 in
2 engines 3
274 kN 61,500 lbf thrust per engine 240 kN 54,000 lbf
548 kN 123,000 lbf total thrust 720 kN 162,000 lbf
165,000 kgs 364,000 lbs MTOW 263,085 kgs 580,000 lbs
7,700 km 4,158 nm range 7,415 km 4,004 nm
M0.8 cruise speed M0.84
266 passengers capacity 250 passengers


You can apply this to J-36 versus NGAD


Extra engine needs extra fuel, that implies more weight see DC-10 is heavier than A-300, but also see A-300 carries more passengers, so actually a third engine does not bring more passengers and the fuel, seat km does not bring a better aircraft DC-10 carries more fuel for the same range and less passengers.

Airbus A300-600 vs. McDonnell-Douglas DC-10-30​

Airbus A300-600 vs. McDonnell-Douglas DC-10-30
www.aviatorjoe.net

If the USA makes better engnes means less number of engines and less engines means less fuel, better thermal efficiency means then you need less fuel, less weight and less weight is a more agile fighter

 

[Nibbler]

J-50 2 engine

J-36 3 engine

H-20 4 engine


They have different uses

They all have one use. which is to sit around doing nothing while amerifats dominate your coastline

 

[Vilander]

Bhai log, I think we are fcuked. Cheers