Indian Air Force: News & Discussions (36 Viewers)

[liberalredditor]

No need to worry. At least for strategic purposes, we do produce a limited amount of neodymium, praseodymium, and samarium. Our mining and refining of rare earth elements have so far been largely restricted to strategic use only.

Do watch the interview of irel babu sahab on cnbc tv18, rare earths incentive will come worth 2000 cr

 

[redpanda]

Good read for anyone who want a text version of that podcast.

Some key takeaways:

- DefSec/MoD is not happy with the moon, mars and Jupiter trials of our armed forces.

- Funding shortages are not there. The process is the problem. And they are planning to fix it.

- F-35/Su-57 are not on the table. They are going full throttle on AMCA.

No more long delays: Defence secretary says India plans to reduce weapon buying timeline from 6 to only 2 years

Defence Secretary Rajesh Kumar Singh revealed India's strategic military advancements, including Operation Sindoor, which targeted terrorist infrastructure inside Pakistan. Following retaliation, India struck Pakistani military airfields, leading to a ceasefire. The focus is now on streamlining...

m.economictimes.com

 

[shade2]

Y'all know what exactly was done with the Su30 that we can test and integrate whatever missiles on it without involving the Ruskals?

Pic related to get your attention



I asked this earlier and some guy says it has an "Indian mission computer", why can't we fix such a mission computer to the Rafales also? is it only a matter of making le Francais upset or is there some hard roadblock like encryption keys only the vendor has?

Which begs the question how did Ruskals agree to this when they too love money just like the French?

 

[redpanda]

Y'all know what exactly was done with the Su30 that we can test and integrate whatever missiles on it without involving the Ruskals?

Pic related to get your attention

View attachment 41002

I asked this earlier and some guy says it has an "Indian mission computer", why can't we fix such a mission computer to the Rafales also? is it only a matter of making le Francais upset or is there some hard roadblock like encryption keys only the vendor has?

Which begs the question how did Ruskals agree to this when they too love money just like the French?

Not possible because it's very expensive and time consuming affair. And we do need some help from the French to even do something like that. Also it will mess up the SPECTRA if we try to install our own stuff in it.

 

[randombully]

Is this some kind of a joke?

View: https://x.com/defencealerts/status/1937773426816504232?t=UpduEiQdDfe0-Hd_4pyz9Q&s=19

The 6 no. Is a misrepresentation of what he said

 

[concard]

Y'all know what exactly was done with the Su30 that we can test and integrate whatever missiles on it without involving the Ruskals?

Pic related to get your attention

View attachment 41002

I asked this earlier and some guy says it has an "Indian mission computer", why can't we fix such a mission computer to the Rafales also? is it only a matter of making le Francais upset or is there some hard roadblock like encryption keys only the vendor has?

Which begs the question how did Ruskals agree to this when they too love money just like the French?

We funded the development of Su-30s after USSR collapsed and Russia was undergoing economic crisis. Since we had the money we were able to extract concessions from Russia. This allowed us to fit technologies from other countries into Su-30 and make it uniquely Su-30 MKI. And no, you can't swap mission control computer of a so and so aircraft with your own. Mission control computer is fitted with lot of other subsystems and they all talk to each other seemlessly. You have a motherboard on your PC uniquely for that particular processor let's say Intel. Now you can't swap that Intel CPU for AMD CPU without changing the entire motherboard made for AMD CPU. All peripherals and drivers made for Intel CPU don't work for AMD CPU. I hope you get the gist of what I am trying to say.

That is why we are asking for access to source code. Changing mission control computer is simply not practical or even feasible at all. If Dassault can simply gives us the flexiblity to integrate our own weapons onto Rafales, that would be great even if they don't want to give source code access. If we are ordering more Rafales then this should be the first sticking point and ask Dassult to yield in return for more orders.

 

[Nicky]

How many Rafales are we buying for this?


View: https://x.com/sidhant/status/1937828437034446851?t=1YI_55GvIXxfNkg0cGH_Pw&s=19

 

[Noob_Saibot]

Good read for anyone who want a text version of that podcast.

Some key takeaways:

- DefSec/MoD is not happy with the moon, mars and Jupiter trials of our armed forces.

- Funding shortages are not there. The process is the problem. And they are planning to fix it.

- F-35/Su-57 are not on the table. They are going full throttle on AMCA.

No more long delays: Defence secretary says India plans to reduce weapon buying timeline from 6 to only 2 years

Defence Secretary Rajesh Kumar Singh revealed India's strategic military advancements, including Operation Sindoor, which targeted terrorist infrastructure inside Pakistan. Following retaliation, India struck Pakistani military airfields, leading to a ceasefire. The focus is now on streamlining...

m.economictimes.com

If we are putting all our eggs in the AMCA basket, then Lord Shiva help us.

We need to buy 90-100 Rafales asap.

I think it is a big mistake having no access to 5th gen assets for 10-15 years, but what do i know.

We will find out in the next few years how the Pakis use their soon to be acquired 5th gen toys against us. We better prepare for misadventures by whatever means necessary.

 

[shade2]

We funded the development of Su-30s after USSR collapsed and Russia was undergoing economic crisis. Since we had the money we were able to extract concessions from Russia. This allowed us to fit technologies from other countries into Su-30 and make it uniquely Su-30 MKI. And no, you can't swap mission control computer of a so and so aircraft with your own. Mission control computer is fitted with lot of other subsystems and they all talk to each other seemlessly. You have a motherboard on your PC uniquely for that particular processor let's say Intel. Now you can't swap that Intel CPU for AMD CPU without changing the entire motherboard made for AMD CPU. All peripherals and drivers made for Intel CPU don't work for AMD CPU. I hope you get the gist of what I am trying to say.

That is why we are asking for access to source code. Changing mission control computer is simply not practical or even feasible at all. If Dassault can simply gives us the flexiblity to integrate our own weapons onto Rafales, that would be great even if they don't want to give source code access. If we are ordering more Rafales then this should be the first sticking point and ask Dassult to yield in return for more orders.

Thanks for the analogy, so viz Rafale it is only a software issue and these greedy froggies seem unwilling to budge.
As you have said they can just make some API which allows us to integrate the astra, rudram and whatever else we have without revealing their precious "source code", if they really want the deal, Govt shouldn't budge on this, pay more if necessary but this capability has to be gotten.

 

[FalconSlayers]

These guys need to stop giving interviews ffs

View: https://x.com/CNBCTV18Live/status/1937784903309074922

Thanks for the analogy, so viz Rafale it is only a software issue and these greedy froggies seem unwilling to budge.
As you have said they can just make some API which allows us to integrate the astra, rudram and whatever else we have without revealing their precious "source code", if they really want the deal, Govt shouldn't budge on this, pay more if necessary but this capability has to be gotten.

Just the fact that Ukraine without even paying shit can fire SCALP missiles from it's Soviet aircraft while we can neither fire own weapons from Rafale nor fire SCALP/Hammer from our Flankers and LCAs despite paying for it is enough a reason to not go for more Rafales. It's an overhyped platform, even worse is the european military industrial complex even during war. The very fact that they import artillery shells from us and other major producers during conflict itself speaks volumes.

 

[redpanda]

These guys need to stop giving interviews ffs

View: https://x.com/CNBCTV18Live/status/1937784903309074922

Just the fact that Ukraine without even paying shit can fire SCALP missiles from it's Soviet aircraft while we can neither fire own weapons from Rafale nor fire SCALP/Hammer from our Flankers and LCAs despite paying for it is enough a reason to not go for more Rafales. It's an overhyped platform, even worse is the european military industrial complex even during war. The very fact that they import artillery shells from us and other major producers during conflict itself speaks volumes.

Not a good analogy. Because Ukrainians were literally part of Soviet Union. And those aircrafts are basically their own aircrafts in a way. It's like saying India can integrate fire SCALP with Tejas but not Su-30 MKI.

 

[shade2]

These guys need to stop giving interviews ffs

View: https://x.com/CNBCTV18Live/status/1937784903309074922

Just the fact that Ukraine without even paying shit can fire SCALP missiles from it's Soviet aircraft while we can neither fire own weapons from Rafale nor fire SCALP/Hammer from our Flankers and LCAs despite paying for it is enough a reason to not go for more Rafales. It's an overhyped platform, even worse is the european military industrial complex even during war. The very fact that they import artillery shells from us and other major producers during conflict itself speaks volumes.

What other option is there saar?
They could buy more Su30s, very good option and a lot of the Ruskal problems can be evaded since 60% is made here, par khauf hai CAATSA ka.

Amerishart platforms out of the question, atleast we can use the Ruskal and French maal to bang the Pakis.

As for current Tejas and MWF this supply chain engine drama will not stop and it may take an official form with the Orangutan having a brainwave of banning GE engine export till Modi makes a ((( deal ))) where he allows US agri exforts into Indian market

Not a good analogy. Because Ukrainians were literally part of Soviet Union. And those aircrafts are basically their own aircrafts in a way. It's like saying India can integrate fire SCALP with Tejas but not Su-30 MKI.

He means to say Europoids let Ukrani condoms fire Scalp from their su-27 but not Indians from su-30 inspite of paying for their wunderwaffe missiles, because "muh roosi will find out" or some paper thin excuse like that.
He has a point, hope some baboo is reading this so it can be used in negotiation with his snail enjoying counterpart from France/Dassault

 

[FalconSlayers]

They could buy more Su30s, very good option and a lot of the Ruskal problems can be evaded since 60% is made here, par khauf hai CAATSA ka.

CAATSA = Countering America's Adversaries Through Sanctions Act

Think about is, are we an "adversary" like Iran, Russia, China, NoKo etc? Nope. We literally ordered 12 more Su-30MKI few months back. Probably not buying more of them is due to the excuse of delayed Super Sukhoi upgrade programme. So buying more of older variants and then upgrading them all is unfeasible and senseless for IAF. It's like you buying À la carte meal after a combo meal and discarding what you don't like out of the combo to have it with the À la carte dish, you get the point.

Also, given the fact that we don't have dedicated EW aircrafts, like USA has E/A-18 Growlers and China has J-16D, a dedicated EW variant of Flankers makes sense, but is IAF interested? Nope. They don't even have plans for dedicated EW aircrafts. They want more importkhori.

 

[silentassassin265]

Thanks for the analogy, so viz Rafale it is only a software issue and these greedy froggies seem unwilling to budge.
As you have said they can just make some API which allows us to integrate the astra, rudram and whatever else we have without revealing their precious "source code", if they really want the deal, Govt shouldn't budge on this, pay more if necessary but this capability has to be gotten.

Even with all the integration how will it be better then su30mki?
It has an underpowered engine and can't carry heavier missiles.
If pork gets j35 and pl17 missiles we might have to fire from more than 250km away from border and only air launched bramhos will be fast enough from that distance.
And it will be easier to just develope astra mk3 than to beg frenchs for integration.
Rafale now cost more than f35, if we can just mass produce su30mki again it will be lot cheaper, we have already ordered 12

 

[silentassassin265]

CAATSA = Countering America's Adversaries Through Sanctions Act

Think about is, are we an "adversary" like Iran, Russia, China, NoKo etc? Nope. We literally ordered 12 more Su-30MKI few months back. Probably not buying more of them is due to the excuse of delayed Super Sukhoi upgrade programme. So buying more of older variants and then upgrading them all is unfeasible and senseless for IAF. It's like you buying À la carte meal after a combo meal and discarding what you don't like out of the combo to have it with the À la carte dish, you get the point.

Also, given the fact that we don't have dedicated EW aircrafts, like USA has E/A-18 Growlers and China has J-16D, a dedicated EW variant of Flankers makes sense, but is IAF interested? Nope. They don't even have plans for dedicated EW aircrafts. They want more importkhori.

We are sitting and doing nothing for past 12 years on mmrca and mrfa.
Out of all aircrafts offered in both compitition isn't su30mki more practical than all of them even in current configuration?

 

[shade2]

CAATSA = Countering America's Adversaries Through Sanctions Act

Think about is, are we an "adversary" like Iran, Russia, China, NoKo etc? Nope. We literally ordered 12 more Su-30MKI few months back. Probably not buying more of them is due to the excuse of delayed Super Sukhoi upgrade programme. So buying more of older variants and then upgrading them all is unfeasible and senseless for IAF. It's like you buying À la carte meal after a combo meal and discarding what you don't like out of the combo to have it with the À la carte dish, you get the point.

Also, given the fact that we don't have dedicated EW aircrafts, like USA has E/A-18 Growlers and China has J-16D, a dedicated EW variant of Flankers makes sense, but is IAF interested? Nope. They don't even have plans for dedicated EW aircrafts. They want more importkhori.

Even with all the integration how will it be better then su30mki?
It has an underpowered engine and can't carry heavier missiles.
If pork gets j35 and pl17 missiles we might have to fire from more than 250km away from border and only air launched bramhos will be fast enough from that distance.
And it will be easier to just develope astra mk3 than to beg frenchs for integration.
Rafale now cost more than f35, if we can just mass produce su30mki again it will be lot cheaper, we have already ordered 12

I'd give phull sapport for ordering 5 sqdrns/90 planes of Su30, we can plug whatever we want on it, pilots have experience on it, big enough to carry a lot of missiles and bombs.

Second choice is Rafale.

Apart from these two there is nothing else.

 

[shade2]

We are sitting and doing nothing for past 12 years on mmrca and mrfa.
Out of all aircrafts offered in both compitition isn't su30mki more practical than all of them even in current configuration?

It is but uniformed class wants Rafale onleee
Govt scared of CAATSA or whatever other unofficial American punishments that may come.

Su30 also avoids the whole Ruskal Delays since 60% of it is made in India including parts of the engine, as compared to buying something like Su57 with a different supply chain

Ideally we should have bought 90 Su30 many years back and started Super Sukhoi upgrade program in earnest, atleast get the first batches rolled out with impoorted subsystems, perhaps something like aesa radar developed in partnership with the Jooz or any other foreign vendor willing to collaborate.

I envy the chongs and their Su-27 clones yaar

 

[shade2]

View: https://x.com/ANI/status/1937824394836877558

Safran MRO in Hyderabad to do MRO of M88 Engines also
First outside of France.

What explains this desperation from these froggies?
You'd expect them to behave even more arrogantly now that they have orders from like Indonesia, UAE and some other countries?

 

[concard]

View: https://x.com/ANI/status/1937824394836877558

Safran MRO in Hyderabad to do MRO of M88 Engines also
First outside of France.

What explains this desperation from these froggies?
You'd expect them to behave even more arrogantly now that they have orders from like Indonesia, UAE and some other countries?

FCAS program which is a 6th generation fighter program with Germany, Spain, and France has run into headwinds. They had a spat recently on the workshare distribution of the project just like exactly we had with Russia over FGFA project.

Spat over Europe’s next-gen fighter program spills over at Paris Air Show

Public bickering between France and Germany doesn’t bode well for the continent’s efforts to build up military capability.

www.defenseone.com

Now the French are thinking about going alone. Going solo gives them lot of freedom but comes with a bigger price tag since the French will be footing the entire bill. They had the same problem 45 years ago when they wanted to build a 4th generation fighter aircraft. They couldn't agree with UK and Germany on few things. So they went alone and built Rafale. It worked out well for them.

Now the situation is different. This project requires massive funding which Dassault does not have at their disposal. Even with some help from French government it will be difficult to pull it off. I read somewhere about Dassult CEO or some chief engineer visiting Lockheed Martin F35 production line and he was given a demo of F35 capabilities. The demo blew their minds and they came home thinking they need more than money to build a 5th or 6th generation fighter aircraft. Unfortunately I couldn't find the link.

I strongly believe Dassult is counting on more orders from India. All these things are just to sweeten the deal and knock any comptetition out of the game.

 

[liberalredditor]

It is but uniformed class wants Rafale onleee
Govt scared of CAATSA or whatever other unofficial American punishments that may come.

Su30 also avoids the whole Ruskal Delays since 60% of it is made in India including parts of the engine, as compared to buying something like Su57 with a different supply chain

Ideally we should have bought 90 Su30 many years back and started Super Sukhoi upgrade program in earnest, atleast get the first batches rolled out with impoorted subsystems, perhaps something like aesa radar developed in partnership with the Jooz or any other foreign vendor willing to collaborate.

I envy the chongs and their Su-27 clones yaar

its not that uninformed class wants rafale, its the safest and proven bet which can arrive by 2030 ie before mwf mk2 gets into production. if we get f4 variant with good bargaining its a good deal, we have the infra of previous deal. we can use the options clause. although priority should always be indigenous systems
but another 2-3 sq of rafale should be ordered asap, spectra can control j35 till we get mwf and amca mk1

2nd option is super sukhoi from nashik, but with composites, we have the production line, we can get 2 more squadrons and 300 su30 mki would be a good idea