Indian Navy Developments & Discussions

[Binayak95]

Jaziya……. Choose your words carefully.

Ignore the fanboyism.

We have just secured ASW ascendancy for the IOR. I am happy.

 

[Anants]

Ignore the fanboyism.

We have just secured ASW ascendancy for the IOR. I am happy.

Yep as long as uncle SAM allows us to use it we shall use it. One positive thing out of it - now Indian Navy shall know what should be added and what should not be added to once they decide to go in for in house version of ISTAR

 

[Hari Sud]

This video is worth watching about capability of predator drones and nuclear attack submarines


View: https://youtu.be/7hfAWbZ2LY8

 

[Blademaster]

Ignore the fanboyism.

We have just secured ASW ascendancy for the IOR. I am happy.

Yes as long as US allows you to do so. What will you do if US decides to brick those assets?

 

[shade2]

Yes as long as US allows you to do so. What will you do if US decides to brick those assets?

They will do it, the question is now of "when" not of "if"

However they should be prepared of the long term consequences of such a stunt, there will be multiple "I TOLD YOU SO" from anti-Amreeki-maal shills, as it is they are not considered a reliable supplier, such a stunt would def be a nail in the coffin.

I hope y'all nibbiars remember INS Jalashwa.

 

[Binayak95]

They will do it, the question is now of "when" not of "if"

However they should be prepared of the long term consequences of such a stunt, there will be multiple "I TOLD YOU SO" from anti-Amreeki-maal shills, as it is they are not considered a reliable supplier, such a stunt would def be a nail in the coffin.

I hope y'all nibbiars remember INS Jalashwa.

What about the Jalashwa. Served onboard her for quite some time.

I don't get y'all paranoia.

Believe you me we would have refrained from buying the second lot of Poseidons and the Romeos if we were not convinced of their sustainable use.

To add to this : the Vikrant, the Shivaliks, the Nilgiris, the Jalashwa, and by all accounts the NGC, NGF and NGD all have or will have the LM2500 GT from GE.

And this engine is the most reliable, with the fastest turn around of all our marine engines (with the exception, perhaps - of some of the diesels).

 

[Binayak95]

Yes as long as US allows you to do so. What will you do if US decides to brick those assets?

"As long as the US allows you to do so"

you mean like the oh so successful Tank Ex project? wait - the Russians scuttled it

or do you mean the integration of the Exocet onto the og Seakings - no wait, the French scuttled that program

or the integration of Sea Eagles to the IL38, oh no that too was Soviet

or the refinement of Monocrystalline blade manufacturing to reduce the titanium wastage - nope that was the Russians again.

or the scuttling of the K30 Biho program - no, that was the Russians once again.

 

[mist_consecutive]

India, US sign Rs 32,000-crore deal for 31 Predator drones

The development comes less than a month after Prime Minister Narendra Modi and US President Joe Biden held talks about the acquisition of the Predator drones on the sidelines of the Quad Leaders' Summit held in Delaware.

www.indiatoday.in

Deal is signed, do we pay the Jaziya all at once, or in installments depending on delivery of the drones?

MQ-9 is not jizya, it is a decent & required capability. Don't listen to illiterate fanboys comparing it with Tapas and TB2 - type RPAs.

There is a reason a majority of the pew-pew and boom-boom platforms used across the 3 forces come from Russia, France, Israel or other countries but not from the US.

And the reason is America's unwillingness to sell us their defence platforms due to us being Soviet-leaning country since independence.

Yes as long as US allows you to do so. What will you do if US decides to brick those assets?

Iran is still flying their F-14 Tomcats armed with AIM-54 phoenix acquired in 1970.

Anyway, for this exact reason we don't acquire frontline assets from America, only support assets. But from the actions of Pak on Feb 19 it is clear America really doesn't care unless you are attacking another NATO state.

 

[crazywithmath]

MQ-9 is not jizya, it is a decent & required capability. Don't listen to illiterate fanboys comparing it with Tapas and TB2 - type RPAs.

That Stryker deal is jizya, right?

 

[shade2]

What about the Jalashwa. Served onboard her for quite some time.

I don't get y'all paranoia.

Believe you me we would have refrained from buying the second lot of Poseidons and the Romeos if we were not convinced of their sustainable use.

When this ship was purchased, in the contract there were conditions where Muricans could (((inspect))) the ship at regular intervals, there was a CAG inquiry about this etc.
Navy needed this type of ship because we didn't have anything similar, same to how we leased the one Nuclear sub from Russia or we leased the 2x predator drones in the past.

Anywhoo the (((inspections))) related to some stuff on the ship not the ship itself, so all these free and democratic parts were replaced over the course of two refits so now no american inspections are needed.

TLDR is this burger (((inspection))) stunt was only reserved for us, don't think they have done this for any other customer country, if they are this suspicious of us, you can imagine what else they have prepared

To add to this : the Vikrant, the Shivaliks, the Nilgiris, the Jalashwa, and by all accounts the NGC, NGF and NGD all have or will have the LM2500 GT from GE.

And this engine is the most reliable, with the fastest turn around of all our marine engines (with the exception, perhaps - of some of the diesels).

Not disputing quality of engines and ease of maintenance, the problem here is not the products, not even the vendor but dickery by the vendor's govt.

 

[shade2]

MQ-9 is not jizya, it is a decent & required capability. Don't listen to illiterate fanboys comparing it with Tapas and TB2 - type RPAs.

Ok

And the reason is America's unwillingness to sell us their defence platforms due to us being Soviet-leaning country since independence.

Not willing to sell us was in the past, now they are willing to sell us atleast the bottom barrel of their stuff and they are very enthu about this, ex LM's F16

Anyway, for this exact reason we don't acquire frontline assets from America, only support assets. But from the actions of Pak on Feb 19 it is clear America really doesn't care unless you are attacking another NATO state.

However as you yourself have mentioned here, even the Imported Airforce steers away from buying boom-boom platforms from Burgers, -- inspite of them simping for Make In India by getting into deals with Tata for subcomponent assembly here of F16 wings, Apache fuselage and some other part for the one transport Turboprop that is in service with IAF -- but seem to prefer Rafale or Russian gear even though the Russkies are unscrupulous vendors and the French have a lot of nakhras aside from the cost of their gear.

Therefore we only seem to buy Gandhian, Ahimsavadi and Peaceful platforms from Burger like various transport aircraft and now these unarmed Predators for the Navy and other two forces.

Only exception to this rule seems to be those M777 Howitzers in service with the Army.

P8i Poseidon and MH 60 Romeo seem to be semi-Peaceful since i read we have recently purchased Torpedos so they can be used for ASW also apart from just detection of subs.

I'd assume the forces know something, and so does the govt, which is why American combat platforms are positively avoided unless it's for literally jaziya like Stryker or only 6 Apaches.

 

[Blademaster]

"As long as the US allows you to do so"

you mean like the oh so successful Tank Ex project? wait - the Russians scuttled it

or do you mean the integration of the Exocet onto the og Seakings - no wait, the French scuttled that program

or the integration of Sea Eagles to the IL38, oh no that too was Soviet

or the refinement of Monocrystalline blade manufacturing to reduce the titanium wastage - nope that was the Russians again.

or the scuttling of the K30 Biho program - no, that was the Russians once again.

I didn't ask you about the Russians or the French. I asked you about the Americans.

 

[mist_consecutive]

Not willing to sell us was in the past, now they are willing to sell us atleast the bottom barrel of their stuff and they are very enthu about this, ex LM's F16

Because we are a big customer. Most countries order equipments in token numbers (~10-20), our requirements and hence orders are massive.

Our order of 31 MQ-9 Reaper makes us the 2nd largest operator of MQ-9 after USA. Similarly, we are 2nd largest operator of C-17 Globemaster.

Therefore we only seem to buy Gandhian, Ahimsavadi and Peaceful platforms from Burger like various transport aircraft and now these unarmed Predators for the Navy and other two forces.

Not un-armed. We are ordering Hellfires & GBU-39 SDBs along with it.

Only exception to this rule seems to be those M777 Howitzers in service with the Army.

Can't install a killswitch on a all-metal howitzer thats why.

 

[Binayak95]

When this ship was purchased, in the contract there were conditions where Muricans could (((inspect))) the ship at regular intervals, there was a CAG inquiry about this etc.
Navy needed this type of ship because we didn't have anything similar, same to how we leased the one Nuclear sub from Russia or we leased the 2x predator drones in the past.

Anywhoo the (((inspections))) related to some stuff on the ship not the ship itself, so all these free and democratic parts were replaced over the course of two refits so now no american inspections are needed.

TLDR is this burger (((inspection))) stunt was only reserved for us, don't think they have done this for any other customer country, if they are this suspicious of us, you can imagine what else they have prepared



Not disputing quality of engines and ease of maintenance, the problem here is not the products, not even the vendor but dickery by the vendor's govt.

The inspection was being done because India was then not a signatory to any of the foundational agreements.

The equipment was dismantled brought out for inspection and then reinstalled. The USN officers were never allowed onboard.

Now, with the foundational agreeements in place (and further enhanced agreements being signed) we do not have inspections

Besides, today IN and USN and RAN units are OPERATIONALLY being deployed to each other's bases.
With all that the word entails.

 

[Binayak95]

I didn't ask you about the Russians or the French. I asked you about the Americans.

the same Americans whose GBu105 bombs somehow became the IAF's defacto anti armour choice for Jaguars even though we never had good relations in the 80s and 90s.

Same americans whose paveway II suddenly managed to be dropped on Tiger Hill WHEN it was never there in the IAF's inventory at all?

Have any of you thought about what that means?
A hitherto unknown bomb to the IAF is within 10 days integrated onto the Mirages, and then the mission computer is programmed to allow litening targeting pods to designate laser for the same bomb.

How did that happen?

The same US that literally saved the lives of i dont know how many hundreds of men by emergency airlift of extreme weather gear when our IA had never envisaged a requirement for extended mobilisation and deployment of troops through a harsh winter - the sheer levels of IA's stupidity aside, we still see the ECU pattern gear today, 3 years since the clashes.

I can go on and on.

But our paranoia regarding the US State Dept (which is btw far far worse than assumed) shouldnt leak and latch onto the Pentagon.

Treat them differently, and get ahead with your business (as this govt is doing)

 

[Blademaster]

the same Americans whose GBu105 bombs somehow became the IAF's defacto anti armour choice for Jaguars even though we never had good relations in the 80s and 90s.

Same americans whose paveway II suddenly managed to be dropped on Tiger Hill WHEN it was never there in the IAF's inventory at all?

Have any of you thought about what that means?
A hitherto unknown bomb to the IAF is within 10 days integrated onto the Mirages, and then the mission computer is programmed to allow litening targeting pods to designate laser for the same bomb.

How did that happen?

The same US that literally saved the lives of i dont know how many hundreds of men by emergency airlift of extreme weather gear when our IA had never envisaged a requirement for extended mobilisation and deployment of troops through a harsh winter - the sheer levels of IA's stupidity aside, we still see the ECU pattern gear today, 3 years since the clashes.

I can go on and on.

But our paranoia regarding the US State Dept (which is btw far far worse than assumed) shouldnt leak and latch onto the Pentagon.

Treat them differently, and get ahead with your business (as this govt is doing)

Then why is the US government trying to incriminate the Modi government for Nijjar's killing?

 

[Binayak95]

Then why is the US government trying to incriminate the Modi government for Nijjar's killing?

Like I said, de link the State Dept from Pentagon.

The state dept is classist, uses left wokism as a cover to control the narrative and is more or less hostile to an assertive India.

And secondly, we did kill the fucker XD

 

[Anants]

Like I said, de link the State Dept from Pentagon.

The state dept is classist, uses left wokism as a cover to control the narrative and is more or less hostile to an assertive India.

And secondly, we did kill the fucker XD

But remember State dept calls the shots - as State dept often represents what Deep State wants. Pentagon and State Dept look like they are not aligning - but its just bureaucratic inertia which makes look like Pentagon and State Dept differs. Pentagon take time for policy reversal. Remember when US was in Afghan and events before - when US was truly angry at Pak - put on military sanctions on it. Yet pentagon continued to have good relations with pak for quite some time - IIRC we use to read articles how Pak had made good contacts in pentagon and so on.

If US and its allies decide to put sanctions - slowly affects will start trickling to complete shutdown of any cooperation.

US makes good weapon equipment. No one doubts that. Its spends so much on R&D - that it affects are visible. However our concern is not quality or efficacy of weapons. But out concern is ability to use and continue to use these expensive platforms even when relations with US go adverse. For eg - What If India decides to go to town about US interference in North East India - where it has even its ex SF /SF people working either in NE or or in Myanmar directing instability in India?

Its Nation's survival instinct that kicks in whenever we have to deal with dubious ex colonials ruling countries. And that is good thing too have.

 

[Abhijeet]

Then why is the US government trying to incriminate the Modi government for Nijjar's killing?

Donald Trump's war against ‘Deep State’, its link with Biden and impact on 2024 US election | Explained

https://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/us-news/donald-trumps-war-against-deep-state-its-link-with-biden-and-impact-on-2024-us-election-explained-101721473955064.html

The deep state, according to an American political conspiracy theory, is a covert network of federal employees, particularly those who work for the FBI and CIA, that collaborates with prominent figures from the financial and business sectors to wield power alongside or inside the democratically elected US government.

 

[shade2]

Like I said, de link the State Dept from Pentagon.

The state dept is classist, uses left wokism as a cover to control the narrative and is more or less hostile to an assertive India.

And secondly, we did kill the fucker XD

But remember State dept calls the shots - as State dept often represents what Deep State wants. Pentagon and State Dept look like they are not aligning - but its just bureaucratic inertia which makes look like Pentagon and State Dept differs. Pentagon take time for policy reversal. Remember when US was in Afghan and events before - when US was truly angry at Pak - put on military sanctions on it. Yet pentagon continued to have good relations with pak for quite some time - IIRC we use to read articles how Pak had made good contacts in pentagon and so on.

If US and its allies decide to put sanctions - slowly affects will start trickling to complete shutdown of any cooperation.

US makes good weapon equipment. No one doubts that. Its spends so much on R&D - that it affects are visible. However our concern is not quality or efficacy of weapons. But out concern is ability to use and continue to use these expensive platforms even when relations with US go adverse. For eg - What If India decides to go to town about US interference in North East India - where it has even its ex SF /SF people working either in NE or or in Myanmar directing instability in India?

Its Nation's survival instinct that kicks in whenever we have to deal with dubious ex colonials ruling countries. And that is good thing too have.

It's better to think of State Dept and Pentagon as Bad Cop and Good Cop.

But at the end of the day the whole Thana is controlled by those of the Bad Cop's inclinations so...

For all the malai-khori of Imported Airforce and Imported Army, if they still avoid Burger combat platform, which have the most malai enjoyment potential, they know something that we don't know