Indian Navy Developments & Discussions

[Blademaster]

Dude, I said the same thing (more or less)!!

Great minds think alike!!

 

[Fatalis]

MR-SAM is the Army version of LR-SAM

Nope not anymore. All the three versions are now known as MRSAM only.

 

[Ayan Barat]

The MRSAM system is a standard fit, onboard multiple Indian Naval Ships and is planned to be fitted on the majority of the future platforms planned for acquisition. - From PIB

INS Tamala would be commissioned in 2025/26 and it'd be equipped with Shtil-1 despite the fact that Indian warships are firing Barak-8 since 2015. So even if Kusha is tested today, I don't think any ships from Nilgiri class would be sporting them. Maybe P-17B or P-18 would start to field them and then slowly with each MLU all older ships would get retrofitted.

So yeah, future ships would be fielding Barak-8s and we'd be needing around 300 more Barak-8s to sustain the stocks till everyone gets Kusha. So both the statements are not inclusive.

I mean, we have this one, don't we?? Granted, it's for VL-SRSAM but I don't see why a slightly bigger version cannot be made for a desi Barak 8.

Again, the seeker size is not an issue. Because if indeed it was then you already have a bigger seeker in the form of Akash-NG.
Which I'm pretty sure is also the seeker used on Kusha too given how they've written "short, medium and long ranged SAM"

It's either a lack of will or they simply know that Kusha is around the corner so why waste money on R&D of a missile that's already slated for retirement.

 

[Blood+]

INS Tamala would be commissioned in 2025/26 and it'd be equipped with Shtil-1 despite the fact that Indian warships are firing Barak-8 since 2015. So even if Kusha is tested today, I don't think any ships from Nilgiri class would be sporting them. Maybe P-17B or P-18 would start to field them and then slowly with each MLU all older ships would get retrofitted.

So yeah, future ships would be fielding Barak-8s and we'd be needing around 300 more Barak-8s to sustain the stocks till everyone gets Kusha. So both the statements are not inclusive.

Again, the seeker size is not an issue. Because if indeed it was then you already have a bigger seeker in the form of Akash-NG.
Which I'm pretty sure is also the seeker used on Kusha too given how they've written "short, medium and long ranged SAM"
View attachment 22038
It's either a lack of will or they simply know that Kusha is around the corner so why waste money on R&D of a missile that's already slated for retirement.

This one may already be on its way out as AESA-based seekers appear to be all the rage these days. But yes, overall, your assessment seems on point.

 

[Bleh]

Something interesting.

INS Traya, a Mobile Missile Coastal Battery (MMCB) Squadron stationed near Mumbai since 1964. Equipped with P 15M Termit missile based coastal batteries.

The need to be in A&N Isles

 

[shade2]

Nope not anymore. All the three versions are now known as MRSAM only.

btw what's up with this Sarkari lingo of using these alphabet soup names in official Press Release

They will not say "OtoMelara 76mm Strales" they will say "BHEL Upgraded SRGM"
They don't say "Barak-8 SAM" they say "MRSAM By BDL"

I hcope that it is because we have cloned the imported parts so don't want to get into diplomatic panga.

 

[Fatalis]

btw what's up with this Sarkari lingo of using these alphabet soup names in official Press Release

They will not say "OtoMelara 76mm Strales" they will say "BHEL Upgraded SRGM"
They don't say "Barak-8 SAM" they say "MRSAM By BDL"

I hcope that it is because we have cloned the imported parts so don't want to get into diplomatic panga.

We never used Barak-8 instead we used MRSAM.

MRSAM is the joint venture missile and tailor made to meet our needs. No other military uses MRSAM but only us.

 

[Bleh]

Nope not anymore. All the three versions are now known as MRSAM only.

Hol'up what's the difference between Naval MR-SAM & LR-SAM as on today then?

Also VL-SRSAM is necessary. A dual-pulse have it's used on longer ranges but Astra is touted as our most maneuverable dart at short ranges! There should be a battery of it on everything, further range extension comes later.

 

[shade2]

We never used Barak-8 instead we used MRSAM.

MRSAM is the joint venture missile and tailor made to meet our needs. No other military uses MRSAM but only us.

This is the one with 70km range?

Makes sense why people above were saying VL-SRSAM + Kusha missiles will be the full replacement of Barak-8 then

'Desi’ S-400: All about Project Kusha, India’s very own long-range air defence system

At the heart of Project Kusha is the development of Long-Range Surface-to-Air Missiles or LR-SAM. The project, first greenlit in 2022, was given Acceptance of Necessity last month.

theprint.in

different types of interceptor missiles designed to hit hostile targets at 150 km, 250 km, and 350 km ranges.

VL-SRSAM is said to be from 50km-80km range so these 4 would make a complete ADS layer

 

[Bleh]

Hol'up what's the difference between Naval MR-SAM & LR-SAM as on today then?

WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NAVAL MR-SAM & LR-SAM?

 

[shade2]

There's in no UVLS, there's no UVLS in near future. Go through all the cross-section of some half a dozen missiles we've and also the different launch methods we use and you'll realise how tough it is to develop a VLS when you're going backwards.

I meant a more limited UVLS for Kusha + VL-SRSAM missiles( hot launch ? ), and another different one for , Nirbhay type bigger missile ( cold launch )

Is this feasible or is it just better going with individual VLSs ?

Like ignoring Tomahawk, LRSASM, ASCROC and all, Mk41 VLS can handle ESSM, SM-2, SM-6 and SM-3.




imo if they decide on UVLS now they can make design changes to the Kusha missiles to fit the VLS, and they can make changes in the successor for VL-SRSAM based on Astra mk2/mk3 to fit this UVLS.

 

[Blood+]

I meant a more limited UVLS for Kusha + VL-SRSAM missiles( hot launch ? ), and another different one for , Nirbhay type bigger missile ( cold launch )

Is this feasible or is it just better going with individual VLSs ?

Like ignoring Tomahawk, LRSASM, ASCROC and all, Mk41 VLS can handle ESSM, SM-2, SM-6 and SM-3.


View attachment 22045

imo if they decide on UVLS now they can make design changes to the Kusha missiles to fit the VLS, and they can make changes in the successor for VL-SRSAM based on Astra mk2/mk3 to fit this UVLS.

Why not make the UVLS both hot and cold launch capable?? The Chinese already did that??!!

Or we could go the Russian route and create two different UVLS types - one for them thicc boys like BrahMos/ any future hypersonic AShMs and another Mk-41 style one for smaller LACMs and all types of SAMs.
Even the Americans seem to be moving in this direction with their Zumwalt DDGs.

 

[Fatalis]

Hol'up what's the difference between Naval MR-SAM & LR-SAM as on today then?

WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NAVAL MR-SAM & LR-SAM

Previously, Indian Navy used to call the Indo-Israeli missile as LRSAM whereas the Army and Air Force used to call it MRSAM but there was an indigenous program to develop long range sam which is now known as PG-LRSAM AKA Kusha so to avoid confusion Indian Navy changed the name of Indo-Israeli missile from LRSAM to MRSAM. So, now this missile is known as MRSAM in all the tri-service.

 

[Ayan Barat]

WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN NAVAL MR-SAM & LR-SAM?

They say a picture's worth thousand words...

Nirbhay type bigger missile ( cold launch )

Nirbhay's hot launched, not cold

I'd suggest you stop straining your brain so much on VLS and just sit back and enjoy life. We'll have our Mk-41 when we'd be supposed to have one

 

[shade2]

Nirbhay's hot launched, not cold

I'd suggest you stop straining your brain so much on VLS and just sit back and enjoy life. We'll have our Mk-41 when we'd be supposed to have one

Arre what brain strain? I'm only doing timepass discussion and learning here since myself I don't know much about defense tech before checking this thread, some other and googling stuff

UVLS and all is beyond our control and we don't know what the Admirals and DRDO walas are doing no point stressing about this all

Why not make the UVLS both hot and cold launch capable?? The Chinese already did that??!!

Too complex and knowing our DRDO/DPSU lead times...

Or we could go the Russian route and create two different UVLS types - one for them thicc boys like BrahMos/ any future hypersonic AShMs and another Mk-41 style one for smaller LACMs and all types of SAMs.
Even the Americans seem to be moving in this direction with their Zumwalt DDGs.

I also think this is the way, but the focus must be on developing UVLS for the 3 Project Kusha missiles, since these are already in development so making changes shouldn't be much of a problem.

Once this VLS is ready they can make a Mk2 of the current VL-SRSAM to make it quad-packable in the Kusha VLS, like burgers did with ESSM vs older Sea Sparrow



Then again you never know what the Admirals are thinking but we have the main pieces in development with the LRMFR for Radar, Kusha missiles and they just need a UVLS for those Kusha missiles