Indian Special Forces

[Indradeep Roy]

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Bad gun posture.. Indian SFs always look uncomfortable while carrying the gun

 

[Indradeep Roy]

What I am surprised is that itne Tier 1 Units aane ke baad bhi NSG isn't taking any lessons. Only take in 30% of the Knowledge. Pata ni kyun

You need brain to capture knowledge! The soldiers are mostly from rural background unable to handle technology. Going by Chinese mil. journals back in 2010s the PLA faced similar issues, as most recruits used to come from rural areas. Although unaware how they addressed the issue. A gun is not just a piece of metal. Also, Army needs to revamp if officer cadre... introduce more technology.

 

[@elite_warriors26]

View: https://www.instagram.com/p/DGPfca1zBbF/?igsh=MWVsMXJ4Yjl1eW51Mg==

 

[hkdas]

View: https://www.instagram.com/p/DGQE4ueNOOe/?img_index=3&igsh=YmxyamZnZ2RoMmcy

 

[KumaoniReborn]

Buddy I wasn't even wrong the first time; stop pretending like I'm shifting goalpost.
It was you who misunderstood

You said this in your reply;
“The level of budget, training, kits and weapons RR get because they're considered a Tier above regular infantry is what the infantry deserves.”

This is false. Sure, maybe it’s correct for westsern command infantry units but Western Command and Sotuhern command don’t have any modernization progress. In Kashmir, all regular units on LoC have better equipment than not only RR, but even many so called Para Units.


RR is also not considered a “tier above regular infantry”. Don’t know who told you this.

 

[Ayan Barat]

This is false. Sure, maybe it’s correct for westsern command infantry units but Western Command and Sotuhern command don’t have any modernization progress. In Kashmir, all regular units on LoC have better equipment than not only RR, but even many so called Para Units.

Para > Ghatak > RR > Any random Infantry

Just a simple statement that we need to advanced each one of them a echelon above than what they're currently; and there you're, hell bent on proving God knows what. Earlier you misunderstood budgetary allocation as operation, after my clarification you mentioned "outperforming RR units in gun battles" which I've absolutely no idea of being a metric in military. You're even claiming that LoC units have better equipment than Para. Fine; now tell me how many of these equipment are standard issued and how many are unit level acquisition in each of them?

RR is also not considered a “tier above regular infantry”. Don’t know who told you this.

I was told by MoD when they added a separate entry for RR

 

[rkhanna]

RR > Any random Infantry

Why?

- RR units come from Infantry battlalions on Rotation.
- They are a COIN Force that operates on a 4:1 ratio on Contact with OPFOR (basic COIN Doctrine)
- They operate with Overwhelming FirePower and Logistics Support very close from their FOBs
- Do you know what happened to those RR units that were rushed up the mountains in Kargil? Do you know why?


IMO Talking about RR and Infantry in the same sentence and comparing them as if they are 2 different organizations operating in the same sphere of Military Operations belies a poor understanding of what RR is.

 

[Anants]

Why?

- RR units come from Infantry battlalions on Rotation.

True but would not RR returnee would be more Experienced and would have had comparatively better experience on better equipment when compared to its non experienced peer?

 

[rkhanna]

True but would not RR returnee would be more Experienced and would have had comparatively better experience on better equipment when compared to its non experienced peer?

in COIN

Infantry Warfare is a whole different beast. in Orbat, Equipment, C&C, Logistics.

Readup on how these same RR troops faired in Kargil in the initial days because they were rushed from their COIN postings. They needed to re-orient towards Conventional Combat to be effective and that took time.

Also suggest reading up on the build up time it takes a unit to be ready to be deployed in the field from when they enter Kashmir and the Re-orientation Program when they return to their parent units.

COIN vs Infantry Combat is the difference between a Formula 1 Race and the Dakkar Rally.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

True but would not RR returnee would be more Experienced and would have had comparatively better experience on better equipment when compared to its non experienced peer?

Yeah..

I would agree that in terms of weapon handling and laying down ambush or cordon plus in Urban warfare i would put my money on a RR trooper rather than a jawan of a infantry battalion with no experience in RR.

But like @rkhanna said the RR units are no way more superior than Infantry units.

 

[rkhanna]

Yeah..

I would agree that in terms of weapon handling and laying down ambush or cordon plus in Urban warfare i would put my money on a RR trooper rather than a jawan of a infantry battalion with no experience in RR.

But like @rkhanna said the RR units are no way more superior than Infantry units.

RR soldier having experienced incoming fire is and MOUT is probably the only real thing of value.

BUT in MOUT they have the ability to dominate the area from a Force Projection Standpoint (its our own territory) - They simply will deploy entire battalions against 3-7 Opfor. With their Logistics (Medical, Ammo, etc - a short walk away and in relative safety)

IMO that also dulls their MOUT capability in an asymetrical firefight against a numerically peer opfor. (imagine fighting through a town in POK)

For the youngones - read up on the Battle of Falluja (First) - Operation Vigilant Resolve. That was some hellish shit. RR aint equiped or ready or experienced for something like that.

 

[Anants]

Readup on how these same RR troops faired in Kargil in the initial days because they were rushed from their COIN postings. They needed to re-orient towards Conventional Combat to be effective and that took time.

I do remember reading a lot of editorials in TheTribune during and post Kargil asking centre to step up Paramilitary in tackling terror and COIN was eroding Army's battle readiness and they cited the examples you quoted

 

[@elite_warriors26]

 

[@elite_warriors26]

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

RR soldier having experienced incoming fire is and MOUT is probably the only real thing of value.

BUT in MOUT they have the ability to dominate the area from a Force Projection Standpoint (its our own territory) - They simply will deploy entire battalions against 3-7 Opfor. With their Logistics (Medical, Ammo, etc - a short walk away and in relative safety)

IMO that also dulls their MOUT capability in an asymetrical firefight against a numerically peer opfor. (imagine fighting through a town in POK)

For the youngones - read up on the Battle of Falluja (First) - Operation Vigilant Resolve. That was some hellish shit. RR aint equiped or ready or experienced for something like that.

Yes i agree.

RR hasnt really evolved as it should have after the experience it got.

A lot of their success is intel based and then using 10:1 numerical strength and on top of that most ops end up in using RL round or Flame throwers or jugadu Explosions.

Some people here will not realise Sir that a Infantry battalion carries way more firepower than a RR battalion.

Plus,infantry battalion are more suited and trained for a war not only in terms of courses or training but also the logistics..A RR battalion if inducted in a war will cause a lot of confusion.

Lastly,most RR men used to be Red entry types earlier..Their handling of things is very different than a good reputation Infantry battalion.

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

I do remember reading a lot of editorials in TheTribune during and post Kargil asking centre to step up Paramilitary in tackling terror and COIN was eroding Army's battle readiness and they cited the examples you quoted

Oh so u must be near my age..i thought u might also be among the younger crowd here who were not even born then.

 

[me_itsme]

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I was actually talking of a different pic, i think that was some kind of army exhibition type of event. But, these pics are awesome too, never seen them. Thank you so much!

 

[Anants]

Oh so u must be near my age..i thought u might also be among the younger crowd here who were not even born then.

Yo mate seen 80's 90's insurgency too in punjab as kid while sucking on Cadbury's chocolate lollipops or eating brakeman's bread.

 

[Baseplate]

look at that low vis setup

sheeesh

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

Yo mate seen 80's 90's insurgency too in punjab as kid

@rkhanna sir and you at top

Followed by @Alby and me.

We r the oldies here!!