Operation Sindoor and Aftermath

[Indx TechStyle]

View: https://x.com/alpha_defense/status/1926628825573593209?t=eJL7eDwcqmV7VIOz8tWLcw&s=19

Do we have a thread for covering good multimedia from Indian military operations?

 

[concard]

I was going through "Project on Nuclear Issues: A Collection of Papers from the 2017 Conference Series and Nuclear Scholars Initiative", a publication by the gora think tank CSIS. According to their analysis, if India struck Muridke (which happened), we would struggle to gain an upper-hand through air-strikes alone (completely inaccurate). And that India would be forced to do a ground assault.

Goras clearly didn't consider the scenario where India can start striking air shafts/vents of Pak nuclear facilities and blow up the tunnels.

You can see the screenshots below:

Spoiler: Screenshots

View attachment 37253
View attachment 37255

Since the paper is from 2017, they have not taken into account about the technological progress even for 2017. Today's war is not that of trench warfare of WW1 or simply dropping bombs by flying over a target like in WW2. There is enough standoff weapons in our arsenal today to inflict enormous damage to Pakistan without coming anywhere near the border let alone crossing it. I am 100% sure DRDO is considering development of missiles which can be fired from 500km from within our own territory. Replacing rampage, crystal maze missiles with our very own means we can strike Porkistan at will with our air force and dare them to respond.

Our air defenses are only going to get stronger from here on. Especially now DRDO is also developing Project Kusha to replace S400, expect a dense air defense network all over our country. This is something Porkis cannot match. We paid $5.4 billion for S400 for 5 squadrons from Russia. If Porkis want to buy the cheap knock offs from China assuming they are 50% cheaper, it would be $2.5 billion. That would be 25% of their forex today. They can't afford quality air defense systems in the market. So they will go for adding more fighter aircrafts like J-10 and maybe in future J-31. Because unlike air defense systems which can be overwhelmed and expended by firing missiles, fighter aircrafts can be used again and again if they were not lost in combat.

 

[FIELD MARSHAL SAHWNSTEIN]

Why is the back ground noise?

Creating discomfort for the watchers.

Those are peacocks.

Also gives me more confidence that this was over india since peacocks are only found in very select locations.

 

[Physx32]

who is the author of this particular paper?

Elizabeth Whitfield, Program Assistant, Nuclear Policy Program at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace

 

[indrajit]

A couple of MANPADs would really up the ante for all the Paki drones and planes flying around willy nilly.
Porkis don't understand how vulnerable they can get overnight.

Unlike us, porks rely heavily on rotary wing and sometimes, jets, to fight down insurgencies in their COIN ops.
They don't have the heavy border security nor the capability to hold ground the way our military can solely by infantry.

Can they beat back the Taliban if they're able to target their planes or helis in the sky?

I really doubt it, especially considering how easily Pashtuns would switch sides if push came to shove.
We all know the auqat of Pashtuns living in Pakistan. Just ask the previous PM.

Manpads are a 2-way street. We don't want civilian aircrafts brought down, either in Pakistan or in India. That's why there is an unofficial agreement between R&AW & ISI from the 1990's that no Manpads will be supplied.

 

[Muzh]

There was nothing wrong with importing American engines—it was a sensible decision. What is truly problematic is the inadequate investment in India's indigenous engine development program. The country doesn't even have a flying test bed yet.

Designing and manufacturing a complex machine such as a new turbofan engine is a very complex problem and it cannot be solved by throwing money at it. Earlier in this thread I described in detail what is called Product Development & Lifecycle Management (PDLM) under the auspices of Iterative Prototyping. So, I do not want to bore everyone by repeating the same information.

Here is what I suggested years ago but no one listened to me

a. LAC's aerospace design should have been compatible with AL31FN instead of GEF404

b. HAL/DRDO should have entered in contract with Lyulka for ToT of AL31FN

c. HAL/DRDO should have continued development of indigenous turbofan engines based on AL31FN foundation

d. HAL should have continued manufacturing LCA with Lyulka supplied engines until indigenous engines were ready

e. Step c and d above could been done in parallel

China did exactly what I described above. They are now ready to replace AL31FN with their indigenous WS10. As you guessed it, WS10 is based on AL31FN.

 

[samsaptaka]

@Vinash @ezsasa @Indx TechStyle @haldilal
And other mods, time to close this thread ? Op Sindoor is over (despite what GoI trumpets).
If further ops are done it would be a no name strike and a new normal as announced.
Also discussion has degenerated to general topics and some going way OT
Better to lock this thread

 

[haldilal]

View: https://x.com/detresfa_/status/1926629788510273771

 

[Yt2211]

View: https://t.me/goreunit/17806

 

[RoaringTigerHiddenDragon]

View: https://x.com/Goreunit/status/1926478838097215688

Humm

at some point all these "would have" "could have" theoretical assumptions have to consciously fall back on reality checks for confirmation. reality check here is what has been stated and executed by the actual main players in the game, in this case the gormint and security forces. they checked almost every box, that security focussed intelligentsia of the country have been debating on.

we need to have clarity on what has been achieved:

- demonstrate that terrorism is the primary issue between India and pakistan.
- combat proven tag to many of the defence equipment
- raise the cost of an misadventure i.e deterrence
- demonstrate restraint factored into the operational planning
- find space for conventional deterrence, as a response to sub-conventional warfare imposed by paki army.
- find space for conventional retaliation under nuclear overhang.
- call out nuclear bluff
- let pakis know, pakjabi heartland is no longer out of bounds
- there is space for both kinetic and non-kinetic responses.
- remind pakis of their lack of strategic depth .
- erase the distinction between jihadis and their state sponsors.


if folks want to apply their mind, and add more chapters to the playbook, can use the above mentioned points as the new baseline and build on it. we also have to be careful not to over read the outcomes, beyond a point so much so that it blurs the lines between hallucinations and reality.

Except Pakjabis dont care about any of this. Pakjabi Army sends thousands of jaahils to get killed. Porki Army is a mercenary Army propped up by Chaiiina. They have no playbook. Nothing. They have assassinated their own leaders with impunity. If you treat Porki Army on par with decent, professional armies, you have lost the plot right there. Porki Army is just one step above terrorists. It is an Army that runs on jaahil and not on diesel, it believes in jinns and not wins, has a leader who is more of a mafia cartel than a field marshal, worships schwarma rather than dharma, promotes human rapes rather than human rights etc. If you think these porki mercenary army will be deterred by logic and reason, you are making the same mistakes as our brokerats - you are trusting venomous degenerates called the paki crore commanders who are programmed to hate Hindus from the time their grandfathers attended mad madressahs. India by not forcefully insisting that the Pagalgam genocide was done by Porki Army chief mullah muneer, is playing right into the hands of the enemy. Ask the Baloch or the Pashtuns - you do not negotiate with the rogue, mercenary, pakjabi army. You decimate them whenever you get the opportunity.

 

[RoaringTigerHiddenDragon]

Designing and manufacturing a complex machine such as a new turbofan engine is a very complex problem and it cannot be solved by throwing money at it. Earlier in this thread I described in detail what is called Product Development & Lifecycle Management (PDLM) under the auspices of Iterative Prototyping. So, I do not want to bore everyone by repeating the same information.

Here is what I suggested years ago but no one listened to me

a. LAC's aerospace design should have been compatible with AL31FN instead of GEF404

b. HAL/DRDO should have entered in contract with Lyulka for ToT of AL31FN

c. HAL/DRDO should have continued development of indigenous turbofan engines based on AL31FN foundation

d. HAL should have continued manufacturing LCA with Lyulka supplied engines until indigenous engines were ready

e. Step c and d above could been done in parallel

China did exactly what I described above. They are now ready to replace AL31FN with their indigenous WS10. As you guessed it, WS10 is based on AL31FN.

AL31FN is maintenance heavy and not as reliable as western engines. So following the western template for engine development is best. But India should have done it with partners like Japan. But when were we ever farsighted and tech savvy in the armed forces? Only in the last few years things have been changing due to private sector participation. China is following the Soviet Union template.

 

[Ajatshatru]

Operation Sindoor is over. Now is the time for a critical and unbiased analysis.





India must evaluate where its military succeeded, where it fell short, and what lessons can be drawn from the conflict. It is essential to identify strengths that can be built upon and weaknesses that need urgent attention—not just within the Indian military, but also in understanding the vulnerabilities and strength of Pakistan military.





Every conflict offers valuable lessons. India must take this opportunity to reflect, learn, and enhance its preparedness for future challenges. This process should not be confined behind closed doors. Instead, there should be open discussions involving both political and military leadership to ensure that Indian military responses are more effective, coordinated, and decisive in the future.

 

[Ajatshatru]

I’m not sure whether India has lost any fighter jets, but if it has, it’s important to understand why.





While the loss of aircraft is sometimes an unfortunate part of military operations, every incident must be carefully evaluated. Identifying the causes—whether technical, tactical, or strategic—is essential to ensure such losses are minimized or prevented in the future. Continuous improvement and learning from every setback is key to strengthening India’s air power and operational readiness.

 

[Ajatshatru]

@haldilal
Please create a thread for post-war assessments and move my messages there.

 

[Anants]

Ok an image which was being circulated of Rafale engine im Bathinda seems to be image of 2011 vintage


View: https://x.com/Pathak329039603/status/1926335283240280489

 

[Anants]

Those are peacocks.

Also gives me more confidence that this was over india since peacocks are only found in very select locations.

My guess says this could be one that was intercepted over beas. I am seeing towers which were also in some tweet where they proved that missile debris way off course near or on garbage dump in beas.

 

[Ajatshatru]

This engine is not from a Rafale; it belongs to a Su-30MKI that crashed 14 years ago, on Wednesday, December 14, 2011.

 

[Brood Father]

Ok an image which was being circulated of Rafale engine im Bathinda seems to be image of 2011 vintage


View: https://x.com/Pathak329039603/status/1926335283240280489

Doesn't look like unless I am using another report

Rain of death

A frontline Sukhoi-30MKI of the Indian Air Force (IAF), one of the Russian-origin combat jets, crashed barely a couple of kilometres from a village on the city outskirts on Tuesday afternoon, with th

punemirror.com

 

[Ajatshatru]

Doesn't look like unless I am using another report

Rain of death

A frontline Sukhoi-30MKI of the Indian Air Force (IAF), one of the Russian-origin combat jets, crashed barely a couple of kilometres from a village on the city outskirts on Tuesday afternoon, with th

punemirror.com

What’s even more confusing is that there’s only one engine, no fuselage wreckage, and I didn’t see any missiles either.

 

[Brood Father]

What’s even more confusing is that there’s only one engine, no fuselage wreckage, and I didn’t see any missiles either.

Hmm..don't know mate ..On surface this looks like AI image but until proven this cannot be ascertained . Only IAF knows what is the truth behind these images ..