AMCA - Advanced Medium Combat Aircraft

jaijaganath said:
Now where is AD and his claim that we can roll out amca within next 18 months most of the lrus and sub-systems are ready .........
Metal cutting has not begun yet
Click to expand...
The design tweak is for more payload.
The amca rolled in next 18 months will not come with this tweak.
With that Said, is the 50ton press for large single peice bulk head ready?
Or is the prototype intended to use other older methods of assembling multiple parts to form a bulkhead of amca?
 
randombully said:
The design tweak is for more payload.
The amca rolled in next 18 months will not come with this tweak.
With that Said, is the 50ton press for large single peice bulk head ready?
Or is the prototype intended to use other older methods of assembling multiple parts to form a bulkhead of amca?
Click to expand...
Ig they are opting for 2nd option
Coz of u remember they posted a pic of 1/4 bulkhead in poster or some sort of design page

Anyways amca is very far away from realisation hope we don't import any other 5th gen aircraft meanwhile
 
Punisher said:
we did a mistake with LCA-Tejas...by relying soley on american engines....should have created another prototype with russian engines...same goes for AMCA
Click to expand...
There must be conspiracy in selecting American engine. That guy knows very well this can be brought down this way.
 
jaijaganath said:
Ig they are opting for 2nd option
Coz of u remember they posted a pic of 1/4 bulkhead in poster or some sort of design page

Anyways amca is very far away from realisation hope we don't import any other 5th gen aircraft meanwhile
Click to expand...
AMCA now near to death, no hope. Only hope coming from LCA variants.

Why we giving tax, if money going into import.
 
randombully said:
The design tweak is for more payload.
The amca rolled in next 18 months will not come with this tweak.
With that Said, is the 50ton press for large single peice bulk head ready?
Or is the prototype intended to use other older methods of assembling multiple parts to form a bulkhead of amca?
Click to expand...
50k tons*
 
TopWatcher said:
AMCA now near to death, no hope. Only hope coming from LCA variants.

Why we giving tax, if money going into import.
Click to expand...
Actually as per indusrial evolution, all 4gen jets will be hopeess globally after 20yrs, just like 3gen jets today.
AMCA is just an acronym whose shape & form can evolve. The project heads have said that AMCA will have every feature which F-35 has, but after 10yrs. Same feature doesn't mean same component or same quality.
But meanwhile for net 10yrs some gap fillers are required.
I don't think we can have 114 F-35 ot Su-57, just 1 or 2 squads, there could be some more Rafales. But whatever might get imported, F-35 or Su-57, it'll increase pressure on ADA, DRDO, HAL to catch up or COLLAPSE bcoz there won't be demand from IAF for obsolete designs & tech. Many foreign firms got sold out historically.
 
jaijaganath said:
Now where is AD and his claim that we can roll out amca within next 18 months most of the lrus and sub-systems are ready .........
Metal cutting has not begun yet
Click to expand...
It was feeling pity and laughing at the same time watching reps from HAL, ADA and others were cheering about overcoming manufacturing and transport challenges of that Scale Model at Air India pavilion and declaring job well done.
I mean come on, have some shame just for sake of it, even if all of you guys are shameless totally.
 
Bhartiya Sainik said:
Actually as per indusrial evolution, all 4gen jets will be hopeess globally after 20yrs, just like 3gen jets today.
AMCA is just an acronym whose shape & form can evolve. The project heads have said that AMCA will have every feature which F-35 has, but after 10yrs. Same feature doesn't mean same component or same quality.
But meanwhile for net 10yrs some gap fillers are required.
I don't think we can have 114 F-35 ot Su-57, just 1 or 2 squads, there could be some more Rafales. But whatever might get imported, F-35 or Su-57, it'll increase pressure on ADA, DRDO, HAL to catch up or COLLAPSE bcoz there won't be demand from IAF for obsolete designs & tech. Many foreign firms got sold out historically.
Click to expand...
The USAF is already conducting a program to turn F-16s into an autonomous CCA .

https://www.defensenews.com/air/202...self-flying-f-16s-to-test-drone-wingmen-tech/

In other news much before this development , the USAF hopes to run the F-16s & F-15s in their various iterations upto 2050-60.

Not all wars or engagements demand the kind of sophistication that an F-22 , F-35 or a B-21 & their analogues provide. Besides these FAs are supposed to be the tip of the spear . Lesser generations will be needed to comprise the rest of the body of the spear .

Besides the USAF is haemorrhaging thru its rear maintaining the F-22 & especially the F-35 which is the reason they revised their plans & ordered more F-15s ( don't remember the exact version) recently . Then there's the question of the F-35 not been able to attain FOC which will come only with Block 4 .

All this costs a ton of money . If thIs is the plight of the USAF you can well imagine what the other air forces across the world would be facing even if their forces are a fraction of the size of the USAF.

I'm dead sure they'd be re looking their plans in the next couple of years to procure 2000+ F-35s . To think the original plan was to replace all the F-15s F-16s & F-18s with the F-35s by the 2030s. It's just not feasible .

If they do that the test of the programs suffer not to mention supplementary warfare platforms like drones , counter drones , CCAs LMs , etc all of which are / will be vital components of a modern Air Force.
 
Azaad said:
The USAF is already conducting a program to turn F-16s into autonomous CCA . In other news much before this development , the USAF hopes to run the F-16s & F-15s in their various iterations upto 2050-60.

Not all wars or engagements demand the kind of sophistication that an F-22 , F-35 or a B-21 & their analogues provide. Besides these FAs are supposed to be the tip of the spear . Lesser generations will be needed to comprise the rest of the body of the spear .

Besides the USAF is haemorrhaging thru its rear maintaining the F-22 & especially the F-35 which is the reason they revised their plans & ordered more F-15s ( don't remember the exact version) recently . Then there's the question of the F-35 not been able to attain FOC which will come only with Block 4 .

All this costs a ton of money . If thIs is the plight of the USAF you can well imagine what the other air forces across the world would be facing even if their forces are a fraction of the size of the USAF.

I'm dead sure they'd be re looking their plans in the next couple of years to procure 2000+ F-35s . To think the original plan was to replace all the F-15s F-16s & F-18s with the F-35s by the 2030s. It's just not feasible .

If they do that the test of the programs suffer not to mention supplementary warfare platforms like drones , counter drones , CCAs LMs , etc all of which are / will be vital components of a modern Air Force.
Click to expand...

F35 program has been a mess from get to. 3 types of jets - a failure. F35 FOC still nowhere close. F35 cost and maintenance lots of ambiguity.

There is a brutal lesson here. Fifth gen jets are too complex to maintain affordability unless you have total control and domestic production of most components and associated services.
 
Suryavanshi said:
Told you so, HAL shys away from rapid prototyping so we don't see them putting out frames faster. HAL has the capability to put out a flying prototype without the necessary sub system but that's does not fit into HAL Philosophy of manufacturing
Click to expand...
Completely opposite to the Chinese philosophy. The J-20 made it's first flight OFFICIALLY in 2011 . In 2022-23 it received the WS -15 TF with TVC (?) & which will enable it to super cruise.

We still don't know if the J-20 has received its FOC . Then again things are so opaque out there we won't know up until a few years later even if it has received its FOC.

However in a recent talk , a GTRE official who ran into his Chinese counterparts during tests in Russia some 2 decades ago , had something very interesting to report.

He stated the Chinese would be ready to certify their engines as flight worthy as soon as basic parameters were fulfilled which I'm guessing meant as soon as it completed stipulated hours of testing aboard the FTB.

This is important as various data parameters can then be checked & modifications made before coming up with another iteration which would then be brought to Russia for enhanced tests. Their method of testing & prototyping is not all that whimsical as we may think it to be.

Returning to the J-20 , even if we consider the FOC as being granted in 2024-25 that's still a good 13-14 years after the FF. Come to think of it none of the 5th Gen FAs have had a smooth ride from conceptualization to FOC except the F-22 & that was more than 2 decades ago.

Hope ADA / DRDO derives the right lessons & not repeat the mistakes others have made . A few more years in development to correct design kinks is much better than eternal testing .
 
Azaad said:
The USAF is already conducting a program to turn F-16s into an autonomous CCA .

https://www.defensenews.com/air/202...self-flying-f-16s-to-test-drone-wingmen-tech/

In other news much before this development , the USAF hopes to run the F-16s & F-15s in their various iterations upto 2050-60.

Not all wars or engagements demand the kind of sophistication that an F-22 , F-35 or a B-21 & their analogues provide. Besides these FAs are supposed to be the tip of the spear . Lesser generations will be needed to comprise the rest of the body of the spear .

Besides the USAF is haemorrhaging thru its rear maintaining the F-22 & especially the F-35 which is the reason they revised their plans & ordered more F-15s ( don't remember the exact version) recently . Then there's the question of the F-35 not been able to attain FOC which will come only with Block 4 .

All this costs a ton of money . If thIs is the plight of the USAF you can well imagine what the other air forces across the world would be facing even if their forces are a fraction of the size of the USAF.

I'm dead sure they'd be re looking their plans in the next couple of years to procure 2000+ F-35s . To think the original plan was to replace all the F-15s F-16s & F-18s with the F-35s by the 2030s. It's just not feasible .

If they do that the test of the programs suffer not to mention supplementary warfare platforms like drones , counter drones , CCAs LMs , etc all of which are / will be vital components of a modern Air Force.
Click to expand...
Reading twitter youthiyas and their take one would feel like US would only have 5 and 6 th gen in its inventory by 2040-50.
Same goes for china's 6 th gen, it isn't something that changes the dynamics of Aerospace but it's name is being paraded regardless. Indian twitter youthiyas have a humiliation fetish and so they channel it via their ignorance.

Traditional 4th gen aircraft are here to stay and I don't see then going away till the end of this century. 5 and 6th Gen are blade of the spear they aren't the spear themselves. You still need 4th gen aircraft to do CAP and dominate a semi contested airspace.

By all means I see no reason to gaze over tejas, TBDEF, ORCA.

There is such a thing as a 4.5 gen fighter regardless of however inconvenient it sounds.

Tejas employs a lot of composites and some form of anti Radar coating is to be used in the future as well, which puts it apart from traditional 4th gen.
But the most ignored aspect of 5th Gen is its electronics and sensor fusion. Indian youthiyas see a plane like that Turkish 5th Gen jet and think it's the end of the world but they never ask what's under the hood. A major focus of HAL has been development of electronics and we have been quite successful at it as well. 4.5 gen will incorporate a decent amount of sensor fusion in it to edge out the gaps between generations.
In fact this has always been our aerospace philosophy. The statement that AMCA, TBDEF Tejas will all share subsystem literally means maximum possible usage of advance 5 th gen tech in all type of air frames.

no more than 30 to 40% of the airforce of any country will 5 th gen.
 
Azaad said:
The J-20 made it's first flight OFFICIALLY in 2011 . In 2022-23 it received the WS -15 TF with TVC (?) & which will enable it to super cruise.
Click to expand...
Ayan Barat said:
The Chinese school of thought is using brute force to shorten this developmental cycle to unimaginable level; today USAF tests a new hypersonic missile and in mere 10-15 months PLAF would have a prototype ready.
Click to expand...
🥱

And what's Indian school of thought?
So now it's clear that there's this 90% load failure thing and there'd be some redesigning. But still no-one would bother going some extra miles to use this redesigning opportunity to add maybe two Conformal Weapons Bay or increase the dimensions of IWB.
Nope, pita jee ki patlun do bilang to bas do bilang hi chhoti hogi. This is our philosophy

Except for DRDO's missile division, I don't think anyone here even knows the concept of foresight
 
Ayan Barat said:
🥱
.

And what's Indian school of thought?
So now it's clear that there's this 90% load failure thing and there'd be some redesigning. But still no-one would bother going some extra miles to use this redesigning opportunity to add maybe two Conformal Weapons Bay or increase the dimensions of IWB.
Nope, pita jee ki patlun do bilang to bas do bilang hi chhoti hogi. This is our philosophy

Except for DRDO's missile division, I don't think anyone here even knows the concept of foresight
Click to expand...
Mere hisab se agar iaf requirement rakhegi tabhi hoga, seeing how things work.
Question ye he ki, iaf do shorter side weapons bay or to lengthen the iwb ki requirement kyu nahi rakh rahi?
 
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