Chit Chat

[sameer]

If I can't compete for 100% seats because of some muh oppression historically, I want this country to fail and disintegrate. All people who get seats or jobs due to reservation are inferior IMO. No two ways about it. People are free to do mental gymnastics about why they deserve reservation but at the end of the day, they are admitting they are inferior and need special protection.

Anyway, I'm leaving this Bhimta shithole permanently next year. I can see this country's future and it's not going to be a good one.

Calm down my brother calm down.

As They say, there are 5 stages of grief:
Denial
Anger
bargaining
depression
Acceptance.

Many of us are unhappy with the way this country is being run, but at the end of the day it is what it is.

Disintegration of this country will only make everything 10X worse. Remember the history of past 1000 years when we were disintegrated. The sheer amount of destruction waged on this land and on our history is unparalleled. Look at Africa today, one tribe(or caste) fighting, killing and massacring each other. UC's won't better off in such scenarios.

So don't wish for such things. I'd like to believe that you most likely didn't mean that and said it impulsively in the moment.

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

You are still at it? Nitish Kumar literally dropped caste kanging because his own caste survey showed that the vast majority of the SCs and STs were living in poverty. How exactly has reservation helped them? It is the govt who claimed that the resevation benefits would, eventually, trickle down into the lowest strata and make the society more 'equal'. What, then, went wrong that the vast majority of the SCs and the STs are still languishing at the bottom of the pyramid? Even though certain sections have made a fortune out of it?



Meenas are heavily heavily dominant outside Rajasthan too. There are Meena joint secretaries in Assam, in WB, even in Meghalaya. They crack govt exams even outside the Hindi belt.


I brought up Meenas because they should not even be getting the benefits to begin with. But not one 'ambedkarite'/SC-ST rights body will dare to bring this uncomfortable topic up because the SC/ST elites are compromised.



What I think is irrelevant (I oppose any reservation as a matter of principle). Being a UC myself I will be perfectly okay if the gormint scraps the 'EWS' thingy - if my descendents go broke that would be their own doing; the gormint owes them no compensation.




Okay, since you are this confident with this concept of 'muh representation' thingy please point out which exact clauses of the Indian Constituion argues in favor of 'proportional representation'.

I am waiting.


You are boasting over your luck and privilege. Not everyone has the means to move to a city/town.

Irrelevant! I am not asking for your opinion. You are not that important (neither am I).


That's precisely what I wrote? You want 'reservations' to stay because you have higher chances of using the system to your advantage at the expense of our less fortunate ST brethren?

It is perfectly okay to be a hypocrite. I am not blaming you for being one. Just do not come up with justifications which you won't be able to defend.

As much as I argue in favor of merit etc, I acknowledge that I was born privileged and have used it to my advantage. I am not ashamed of admitting it. You should not be either.

ST hv least resources in india from thousand of years...coz they lived mostly inhabitants places, where others not lived. if u talking about ST situation xidnt improved, than planning commission old stats help u:-

so yes ST r most poor in 4 groups, due to "obvious reasons".
yeah this data also proving that reservation in colleges nd jobs also help them.
yes its not written in constitution (in my knowledge) that why ST is giving reservation. but it also didnt say they r given reservation coz of economy, like in OBC nd EWS case. coz ST hv all factors (from poverty, less facility, representation, historical unjustice, less participation etc)....but u guys only see ST given reservation due to economy condition. thatz why u apply all that poverty base logic in our cases.
now u guys make big mistake in case of tribes..all tribes r seprate nd distinguish from each other. but government make a little group by collecting many tribes. for example my tribes r near 5000 population. but government put us in bigger "tribe group" of 37000 population. although we hv no relationship, contect or similarities to them. most our numbers look big (8% of indian population) due to north east nd middle india tribes. so i dont take responsibility of others.
now in uttarakhand 3% population is in ST. out of which 95% in rural areas nd only 5% lived in urban. this urban migration happened in mostly last 20 years. most of them (student) complete their 10th nd 12th in their tribal areas, later they shifted in towns nd cities. i m same case.
so my point is common student cant compete after that to other students. if u want to proof me wrong, u can admit ur children in any ST area schools untill 10th grade. nd later u give them education in best schools nd colleges.
i got that privilege 5 years ago (when i completed my 10th). my all education knowledge before that not even compare to today's 5 class students. that is case with most ST students. coz education isnt necessity but luxury for most in teibal area. In ST areas even if u r middle class, u cant build facilities (like tutions, online classes, better teachers, extra knowledge of carrer etc).
i think u hv no knowledge of ST nd u r comparing them with regular villagers. what can i do than? i cant understand a man about sunburn in summer, who r sitting in AC in summer....bye. happy new year in advance.

 

[crazywithmath]

ST hv least resources in india from thousand of years...coz they lived mostly inhabitants places, where others not lived. if u talking about ST situation xidnt improved, than planning commission old stats help u:-
View attachment 20268
so yes ST r most poor in 4 groups, due to "obvious reasons".

Poverty has fallen even among muslims. That is precisely why the economy was thrown open in 1991.

You are writing nothing new here. The avg ST is still poor compared to the UCs and OBCs. But the privileged lot taking advantage of resrvations aren't. As I pointed earlier, an avg ST guy has near zero odds to bag a group A/group B govt job - with or without reservations.

yeah this data also proving that reservation in colleges nd jobs also help them.

It does not help 'them'. It helps guys like you - who write English, have decent internet and are well educated. It does not help the avg tribal kid.

It is important to distinguish between 'you' and 'them'. Please do not speak for 'them'.

yes its not written in constitution (in my knowledge) that why ST is giving reservation. but it also didnt say they r given reservation coz of economy, like in OBC nd EWS case.

That's literally what the most recent SC judgement on SC/ST subcategorization reads (which you are claiming to disagree with). Are you aware that SC judgements set legal prcedents? That this judgement will be cited every time a case is brought up demanding further subcategorization? Stop clutching onto straws.

now u guys make big mistake in case of tribes..all tribes r seprate nd distinguish from each other. but government make a little group by collecting many tribes. for example my tribes r near 5000 population. but government put us in bigger "tribe group" of 37000 population. although we hv no relationship, contect or similarities to them. most our numbers look big (8% of indian population) due to north east nd middle india tribes. so i dont take responsibility of others.

Lmao, why would you? I already wrote na? You do not care about resrvations at all. You care about your well-being only; a system that was designed to favor a tiny minority of STs and SCs.

Not that I have a problem with this (human nature to look out for one's self interests). So please please drop the pretense that you care about 'representation' and please do not come up with batshit crazy justifications like 'proportional representation' to defend your stand. I won't judge you for being a hypocrite.

now in uttarakhand 3% population is in ST. out of which 95% in rural areas nd only 5% lived in urban. this urban migration happened in mostly last 20 years. most of them (student) complete their 10th nd 12th in their tribal areas, later they shifted in towns nd cities. i m same case.
so my point is common student cant compete after that to other students. if u want to proof me wrong, u can admit ur children in any ST area schools untill 10th grade. nd later u give them education in best schools nd colleges.
i got that privilege 5 years ago (when i completed my 10th). my all education knowledge before that not even compare to today's 5 class students. that is case with most ST students. coz education isnt necessity but luxury for most in teibal area. In ST areas even if u r middle class, u cant build facilities (like tutions, online classes, better teachers, extra knowledge of carrer etc).
i think u hv no knowledge of ST nd u r comparing them with regular villagers. what can i do than? i cant understand a man about sunburn in summer, who r sitting in AC in summer....bye. happy new year in advance.

Please try to write some complete sentences. You can write in Hindi too, if needed.

 

[Gurmeet]

ST hv least resources in india from thousand of years...coz they lived mostly inhabitants places, where others not lived. if u talking about ST situation xidnt improved, than planning commission old stats help u:-
View attachment 20268
so yes ST r most poor in 4 groups, due to "obvious reasons".
yeah this data also proving that reservation in colleges nd jobs also help them.
yes its not written in constitution (in my knowledge) that why ST is giving reservation. but it also didnt say they r given reservation coz of economy, like in OBC nd EWS case. coz ST hv all factors (from poverty, less facility, representation, historical unjustice, less participation etc)....but u guys only see ST given reservation due to economy condition. thatz why u apply all that poverty base logic in our cases.
now u guys make big mistake in case of tribes..all tribes r seprate nd distinguish from each other. but government make a little group by collecting many tribes. for example my tribes r near 5000 population. but government put us in bigger "tribe group" of 37000 population. although we hv no relationship, contect or similarities to them. most our numbers look big (8% of indian population) due to north east nd middle india tribes. so i dont take responsibility of others.
now in uttarakhand 3% population is in ST. out of which 95% in rural areas nd only 5% lived in urban. this urban migration happened in mostly last 20 years. most of them (student) complete their 10th nd 12th in their tribal areas, later they shifted in towns nd cities. i m same case.
so my point is common student cant compete after that to other students. if u want to proof me wrong, u can admit ur children in any ST area schools untill 10th grade. nd later u give them education in best schools nd colleges.
i got that privilege 5 years ago (when i completed my 10th). my all education knowledge before that not even compare to today's 5 class students. that is case with most ST students. coz education isnt necessity but luxury for most in teibal area. In ST areas even if u r middle class, u cant build facilities (like tutions, online classes, better teachers, extra knowledge of carrer etc).
i think u hv no knowledge of ST nd u r comparing them with regular villagers. what can i do than? i cant understand a man about sunburn in summer, who r sitting in AC in summer....bye. happy new year in advance.

Arey bhai ask for better school,better teacher na. Ok give me till when should be reservation be there.

 

[Gurmeet]

View: https://x.com/Tom_Rowsell/status/1873880395135279178

lynching them is easy.

 

[sameer]

View: https://x.com/Tom_Rowsell/status/1873880395135279178

lynching them is easy.

I don't feel sorry for them at all. Not in the least bit.

PS: Doesn't mean I'm defending what the M's did.

 

[jaijaganath]

@mods
Can we ask prashant bhadoria sir to join the forum

 

[Anants]

Brahminical high culture stop putting out caste-supremacy thinking. It is a hindu culture. I have seen retared people from all caste also.

Sorry its communist trope... Nrahmins were and are too few in numbers, with very less financial powers to impose "brahmnical rules". Brahmnical rules are to be followed by people who are ordained brahmins, Shastri or Vedi.

Caste kanging exists in all Indian belonging to all flavors of religions. Each set of religion has their own "brahmnical" sects and rules. But hindus are soft targets as they have no common voice.

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

Poverty has fallen even among muslims. That is precisely why the economy was thrown open in 1991.

You are writing nothing new here. The avg ST is still poor compared to the UCs and OBCs. But the privileged lot taking advantage of resrvations aren't. As I pointed earlier, an avg ST guy has near zero odds to bag a group A/group B govt job - with or without reservations.



It does not help 'them'. It helps guys like you - who write English, have decent internet and are well educated. It does not help the avg tribal kid.

It is important to distinguish between 'you' and 'them'. Please do not speak for 'them'.



That's literally what the most recent SC judgement on SC/ST subcategorization reads (which you are claiming to disagree with). Are you aware that SC judgements set legal prcedents? That this judgement will be cited every time a case is brought up demanding further subcategorization? Stop clutching onto straws.




Lmao, why would you? I already wrote na? You do not care about resrvations at all. You care about your well-being only; a system that was designed to favor a tiny minority of STs and SCs.

Not that I have a problem with this (human nature to look out for one's self interests). So please please drop the pretense that you care about 'representation' and please do not come up with batshit crazy justifications like 'proportional representation' to defend your stand. I won't judge you for being a hypocrite.



Please try to write some complete sentences. You can write in Hindi too, if needed.

lol...plz explain how i m advantaging due to reservation?? i m doing BA, it dont even need any cutoff. live in ur lala land. most of u guys dont look at genral who r getting reservation in different mediums...but ur fingers always stand toward SC/ST reservations. i never met a genral who says, genral reservation r bad. they will always give reson nd justification to reservation on poverty. only they said this, when others asked about other genral reservation. whenever genral gets reservation, they took it open arms. this is history. no other genral said against them. so biggest hypocrite r u guys. atleast we hv justification to take reservation. but u guys hv no reason to take it...u guys enjoying poverty schemes nd reservation by name of poverty. this is ur reality. u called me third time hypocrite. a hypocrite is always labels others as hypocrite...u come to personal attacks third time, thats why any respect for u already ended. i know u will do it, soon or later. thats what most genral do.
.

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

Arey bhai ask for better school,better teacher na. Ok give me till when should be reservation be there.

why cant OBC nd EWS ask for scholarship, fees grant, free education (already aviable), less interest education loans etc...which help them to get comfortable. why they r taking College seats nd jobs instead due to reservation?? can u give any one job, coz they r poor? why its moral duty of ST, but not others. do it nd set example for others.

 

[crazywithmath]

I was being respectful because you are probably way younger than me but it is about time you learn a lesson or two, sorry.

lol...plz explain how i m advantaging due to reservation?? i m doing BA, it dont even need any cutoff.

The fact that your are doing BA and able to communicate in at least broken English already places you in the top 5-7%ile of STs.

STs (barely) make up for 5.8% of the undergrads in this country (as of FY 2023-24).

You also claimed to belong to a 'middle class ST family', no? Do you have any idea how rare a 'middle class' ST is in this nation? Also, you are likely upper/upper middle class too (anyone with a family income > 4 LPA should be considered one).

live in ur lala land.

Why should I? I am past that phase of life. Reservation does not affect me one bit. If you have such deep connections with your 'kanstitutionaal rights' to reservations you should not have engaged in a conversation to begin with.

most of u guys dont look at genral who r getting reservation in different mediums...but ur fingers always stand toward SC/ST reservations. i never met a genral who says, genral reservation r bad. they will always give reson nd justification to reservation on poverty.

I literally wrote that EWS reservations were stupid and should be scrapped altogether. If my descendents go broke it is entirely on them; the govt or the society owes them zero compensation. I even acknowledged that I benefited from being born in a very privileged family because the Indian state is inherently elitist, you nutjob! Cannot you read?

only they said this, when others asked about other genral reservation. whenever genral gets reservation, they took it open arms. this is history. no other genral said against them. so biggest hypocrite r u guys. atleast we hv justification to take reservation.

You have zero justification to cheat on your fellow ST brethren but be happy kanging on it.

but u guys hv no reason to take it...u guys enjoying poverty schemes nd reservation by name of poverty.

Write some proper sentences. What is this ooga booga mumbling?

this is ur reality. u called me third time hypocrite. a hypocrite is always labels others as hypocrite..

Anyone who has followed the entire conversation will know who was acting like one. And for the trillionth time, it is okay to be a hypocrite. I do not judge you for acting like one.

.u come to personal attacks third time, thats why any respect for u already ended. i know u will do it, soon or later. thats what most genral do.
.

If that felt like personal attacks to you then you should really consider leaving internet fora.

The way you cooked up a series of BS points like 'muh proportional representation reee', ' muh I do not agree with SC judgemnets reeee' - trust me, I could have gone way harder on you. So now that you have run out of ammo out do not cry victim.

And while you are at it, stop inserting emojis in serious conversations. It dilutes the points you are making.

why cant OBC nd EWS ask for scholarship, fees grant, free education (already aviable), less interest education loans etc...which help them to get comfortable. why they r taking College seats nd jobs instead due to reservation?? can u give any one job, coz they r poor? why its moral duty of ST, but not others. do it nd set example for others.

Yes. Scholarships and grants for OBCs and EWS. But reservations for the most pampered STs. What an awesome line of thought; marvelous.

At least pretend to be reasonable?

Do you realize how increasingly unhinged and apeshit crazy your takes are becoming? Do you love making a fool out of yourself in public fora?

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

I was being respectful because you are probably way younger than me but it is about time you learn a lesson or two, sorry.



The fact that your are doing BA and able to communicate in at least broken English already places you in the top 5-7%ile of STs.

STs (barely) make up for 5.8% of the undergrads in this country (as of FY 2023-24).

You also claimed to belong to a 'middle class ST family', no? Do you have any idea how rare a 'middle class' ST is in this nation? Also, you are likely upper/upper middle class too (anyone with a family income > 4 LPA should be considered one).



Why should I? I am past that phase of life. Reservation does not affect me one bit. If you have such deep connections with your 'kanstitutionaal rights' to reservations you should not have engaged in a conversation to begin with.



I literally wrote that EWS reservations were stupid and should be scrapped altogether. If my descendents go broke it is entirely on them; the govt or the society owes them zero compensation. I even acknowledged that I benefited from being born in a very privileged family because the Indian state is inherently elitist, you nutjob! Cannot you read?




You have zero justification to cheat on your fellow ST brethren but be happy kanging on it.



Write some proper sentences. What is this ooga booga mumbling?



Anyone who has followed the entire conversation will know who was acting like one.



If that felt like personal attacks to you then you should really consider leaving internet fora.

The way you cooked up a series of BS points like 'muh proportional representation reee', ' muh I do not agree with SC judgemnets reeee' - trust me, I could have gone way harder on you. So now that you have run out of ammo out do not cry victim.

And while you are at it, stop inserting emojis in serious conversations. It dilutes the points you are making.



Yes. Scholarships and grants for OBCs and EWS. But reservations for the most pampered STs. What an awesome line of thought; marvelous.

At least pretend to be reasonable?

Do you realize how increasingly unhinged and apeshit crazy your takes are becoming? Do you love making a fool out of yourself in public fora?

ok. let me ask u directly. when will u leave ur nd ur offsprings reservation rights?? i mean :-
1:- even u dont like EWS...for ur children that option open.
2:- for all ur family females, women reservation aviable in college seats, government jobs nd some private jobs. will u garentee no female from ur family take part on above. coz if they participate, women reservation applied in them automatically. they like it or not.
3:- for ur family state reservation also available in many college seats nd state jobs. will u garentee ur children will not participate in state sponsor seats nd jobs??
4:- for u, sports reservation or quota also aviable. will u garentee ur offspring will not enroll in those colleges nd jobs..who give seats nd jobs on basis of sports.
if u garentee that, ur offspring will not take any these reservation nd institute etc. than i will understand u r not hypocrite. otherwise i see opposite with people. they give lacture of morality etc to others. but in their time they themself benefit from that. .

 

[crazywithmath]

ok. let me ask u directly. when will u leave ur nd ur offsprings reservation rights?? i mean :-
1:- even u dont like EWS...for ur children that option open.
2:- for all ur family females, women reservation aviable in college seats, government jobs nd some private jobs. will u garentee no female from ur family take part on above. coz if they participate, women reservation applied in them automatically. they like it or not.

I am not the Prime Minister of this country. It is not in my power to alter the constitution. I can only express opinions and that I did.

Any reservation is stupid, discriminatory and runs contrary to the principles of equal opportunity - even if it benefits my own 'jaatbhois'.

3:- for ur family state reservation also available in many college seats nd state jobs. will u garentee ur children will not participate in state sponsor seats nd jobs??

There is currently ZERO reservation in offer at any government institution for me or my family. And my kids won't fall in the EWS bracket. So that question does not arise.

4:- for u, sports reservation or quota also aviable. will u garentee ur offspring will not enroll in those colleges nd jobs..who give seats nd jobs on basis of sports.
if u garentee that, ur offspring will not take any these reservation nd institute etc. than i will understand u r not hypocrite. otherwise i see opposite with people. they give lacture of morality etc to others. but in their time they themself benefit from that. .

I am sympathetic to the physically challenged folks and perfectly okay with the kind of reservations they are offered with. Nothing else.

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

I am not the Prime Minister of this country. It is not in my power to alter the constitution. I can only express opinions and that I did.

Any reservation is stupid, discriminatory and runs contrary to the principles of equal opportunity - even if it benefits my own 'jaatbhois'.



There is currently ZERO reservation in offer at any government institution for me or my family. And my kids won't fall in the EWS bracket. So that question does not arise.



I am sympathetic to the physically challenged folks and perfectly okay with the kind of reservations they are offered with. Nothing else.

if u dont know...all state reserve seats in their colleges nd also many state jobs...where they prefer that state people. so yes many college seats nd state jobs available for u (genral) also. also women reservation for all caste available in most states. what r u talking??? kindly do research on it.
u cant run, by saying i m not prime minister. yes u dont make these rule, but u r anti reservation. so all kind of reservation r "halal" for u nd ur family. u will make sure that not even ur offspring will take benefit of any reservation. than only u hv right to criticize others reservation. coz i can also run away, by saying "no our tribes people involved in constitution assembly, parliament nd supreme court...all these tribe nd reservation system applied by government on me, when i was born...so i just taking it, coz others make aviable it to me". .

 

[crazywithmath]

why cant OBC nd EWS ask for scholarship, fees grant, free education (already aviable), less interest education loans etc...which help them to get comfortable. why they r taking College seats nd jobs instead due to reservation?? can u give any one job, coz they r poor? why its moral duty of ST, but not others. do it nd set example for others.

It is crazy how you are so passionately arguing in favor of 'reservations' when the govt is looking to significantly limit the number of govt jobs and normalize contractual hirings, has already mainstreamed outsourcing and will increasingly attempt to divest stakes across a series of important PSUs as well as corporatizing them (simply because the govt cannot let the salaries+pension budget balloon any further). With healthcare and educations going the American way too, 'reservations' are likely to play a very very minimal role in the lives of the future generations. In fact, you are probably the last generation who will significantly benefit from the affirmative policies of the government.

The good thing is that, it wouldn't even make any meaningful difference to the kives of the average citizen (the privileged will continue performing well with or without reservations). And yet look, how agitated you are getting debating the policy with some stranger on an internet board.

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

I am not the Prime Minister of this country. It is not in my power to alter the constitution. I can only express opinions and that I did.

Any reservation is stupid, discriminatory and runs contrary to the principles of equal opportunity - even if it benefits my own 'jaatbhois'.



There is currently ZERO reservation in offer at any government institution for me or my family. And my kids won't fall in the EWS bracket. So that question does not arise.



I am sympathetic to the physically challenged folks and perfectly okay with the kind of reservations they are offered with. Nothing else.

tell me ur state name...i will find out how much women reservation aviable in ur state. nd how many state government jobs nd college to its own state people.

 

[optimus]

> opens dfi after a very long break

 

[crazywithmath]

tell me ur state name...i will find out how much women reservation aviable in ur state. nd how many state government jobs nd college to its own state people.

WB. My alma mater where I studied engg still does not have any "women's quota". It has, however, reserved a significant % of seats for the domiciled students since (wasn't the case when I was a student).

Excluding 'outsiders' from state govt jobs is generally considered unconstitutional.

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

It is crazy how you are so passionately arguing in favor of 'reservations' when the govt is looking to significantly limit the number of govt jobs and normalize contractual hirings, has already mainstreamed outsourcing and will increasingly attempt to divest stakes across a series of important PSUs as well as corporatizing them (simply because the govt cannot let the salaries+pension budget balloon any further). With healthcare and educations going the American way too, 'reservations' are likely to play a very very minimal role in the lives of the future generations. In fact, you are probably the last generation who will significantly benefit from the affirmative policies of the government.

The good thing is that, it wouldn't even make any meaningful difference to the kives of the average citizen (the privileged will continue performing well with or without reservations). And yet look, how agitated you are getting debating the policy with some stranger on an internet board.

i know how low government is providing jobs etc these days...but no other ST questions about genral reservation. onky showing genral critisizing SC/ST for reservation. thats why i always ready to remember genral brothers, that keep ur eyes open. even genral is benefitting with different kind of reservation.

 

[optimus]

@vin pahadi (kumauni) i saw you stated that you live in chamoli etc etc due to geographical reasons you should be entitled to reservation irrespective of your economic status but as far as geographical reasons are concerned many ST are facing same geographical issues as much as a local general guy living in himalayan state so what makes you think you should be entitled for the same while the other guy shouldn't ?