Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

[Corvus Splendens]

My 2 cents , but investing now in MRFA would be the biggest blunder IAF can do in knee jerk reaction
We should focus now in Tejas Mk2 and Orca ..
AMCA should be accelerated and should be completed in war footing
And get indigenous engine sorted even if it means to give Safran / Rolls Royce the fortune ..

On Tejas, scrap the follow up Mk1A order and fastrack Mk2, GE has supply chain issues with G404 engines anyway but the 414 line is always chugging at max capacity due to USN's own requirements and various other clients like SoKo. Redesign the ORCA with recessed bays and proper S curve DSI intakes (a KF-21 analogue) and force the IAF to collaborate on it Parrikar style, as a Su-30 replacement. Order 36 more Rafales to keep the IAF happy in the meanwhile. Development priority right now is AHCA>Tejas Mk2>ORCA.

 

[Brood Father]

Ajeeb concocted logic chal raha iss forum pe...

Some say we can't compete with China in numbers... then some say let's build our numbers to overcome PAF advancements... then some say no pak is not a problem let's focus on China... rinse and repeat.

& for those saying let's focus on MK2... le ghusa diye hum apna gardan TEJAS MK2 ki g**nd mein... ab batao kab shuru hoga production?

Where's the roadmap to achieve 40 squadrons by 2032 or even arrest the fall of squadrons without MRFA?

MRFA also cannot give you 40 squadrons by 2032 , assuming if you sign the deal today it will take atleast 5 years for the jets to roll to India and assuming the production rate to 20 and we ordering 120 it will take 6 years to get all the required jets
Now you paid 20-25 million for 4th gen fighter which is not manufactured in your country and in case of war you would again have to beg to foreign OEM ..

 

[Brood Father]

On Tejas, scrap the follow up Mk1A order and fastrack Mk2, GE has supply chain issues with G404 engines anyway but the 414 line is always chugging at max capacity due to USN's own requirements and various other clients like SoKo. Redesign the ORCA with recessed bays and proper S curve DSI intakes (a KF-21 analogue) and force the IAF to collaborate on it Parrikar style, as a Su-30 replacement. Order 36 more Rafales to keep the IAF happy in the meanwhile. Development priority right now is AHCA>Tejas Mk2>ORCA.

Even 414 could be in jeopardy once F18 goes out of production, what is the plan then ?
Best would be to give fortune to Safran and get engine sorted ..this is should be priority number 1
Once you have engine you can then roll out any jets you want

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

Do you guys think after China's revealing, India can/should skip 6gen & start making 7gen &/or SR-72 Darkstar like fighter just bcoz we tested HSTDV?
There is a thread on Hypersonics:

Thread 'Hypersonic Tech R&D: Aircrafts, Missiles; Scramjet, Air Breating Rocket Engines Etc.'

Jul 31, 2024

Hypersonic means speeds more than Mach 5. Humans have desired both civil & military application but It is still in experiment stage.
Subsonic flight still has accidents. Military pilots have ejection seats & parachutes but civillian passengers don't. Hence even supersonic flight has been restricted after Concord crash which BTW was only for rich people.
High-supersonic flight b/w Mach 3-5 will require higher altitude beyond 60Kft to reduce friction drag, but also require enough air for thrust. Occupats may also need a pressure suit which cannot be practically implemented in civil...

• Bhartiya Sainik
• Replies: 2
• Forum: Global Arms and Industry

• 

but nobody discusses about Hypersonic combat jet.
While IAF chief said 1 liner that they have roadmap for 6gen, but on all the forums taken together i found only 1 person, that too senior member (doesn't mean MTech, PhD) who is saying that India needs to skip 6gen & jump to 7gen Hypersonic Trans-Atmospheric Fighter.
Many people are not convinced that 6gen is defined or not & here we have 7gen declaration.
He also says that we are already focussing on this with indegenous capabilities. He means the HSTDV.

 

[Ayan Barat]

and force the IAF to collaborate on it

As usual...can't agree more.
We two are the only fedaykin in the army of lisan al-ORCA

G**nd ka haddi toota hua hai... aur sab ka fashion ban gaya hai... CANCEL MRFA CANCEL MRFA bolte rehne ka.

Ask few questions
• nothing except Rafale makes sense in MRFA because then you'd further screw your logistics. Or are you going to buy something else?
• what is the delivery capacity of both Dassault and Safran? How long will it take?
• would that deal be expensive or cheaper compared to in-house options?
• what will we be getting other than a bunch of fighters after paying billions? In case of something local we would be getting assembly lines, machineary, infrastructure, multiple OEMs for sub-assemblies, skilled labour on top of the fighters.
• how good would be Rafale? In terms of radar, local avionics and weapons, cost of repair and replacement, in times of war

??? never

PL17+PL15+PL12+PL10

-----------------

the export varient of fin foldable NEW PL15 AAM which fits for the Inner Weapon Bay was displayed last month...obviousely it is the matched option for the FC-31/J-35AE export...

Again, you're missing my point. As of now there used to be just two types of air dominance fighters.
• one with magazine depth of 12-14 missiles but unstealthy
• other with magazine depth of 6-8 missile but stealthy

This new platform of yours seems to have dissolved this distinction and present a challenge people were not expecting to face this early.

 

[RocketMan]

LOL...PLAAF/NAF used to have 10 combat units of J10/10A/10S/10AH/10SH which is around 300 jets...then came the 56 J10Bs and more than 270 J10Cs and unknown number of new batch of J10Ss ...nowadays, quite some J10A/Ss were reassigned to the Flying Academies ; PLANAF also handed over all J10s to the air force. the most of J10 combat units are operating J10B/C and the combat unit quantity is more than 13(3 more units owns some, but they are models mixed units ). A 'Brigade level' Combat unit normally owns around 40 fighters. btw the August 1st aerobatic team has 12 Special varient J10s of their own.

in sum, around 650 all varients of J10s were manufactured for PLAAF and NAF(24 no.). but the J10C volume production for the air force is over... only export order will proceed...

-----------------------
btw , so called 1/4 of PLAAF fleet are J7s is another joke and obviously IAF won't face any PLAAF J-7s in future. nearly 300 no. of J-7 were manufactured around early this century ... a J-7 unit could have 50-60 jets nowadays so the spare parts are sufficient....lol. ..these units are deployed in secondary direction for training.

PLAAF's next mass production model is J-35A ... it's around the coner, it will replace the remaining J-7s and early varient of J10s...and JH-7 is an attacker, so it is something else.
n
View attachment 19872

With these jets & a powerful Navy 1st island chain might be broken before 2050s & entirety of South China sea will become a Chinese lake , not to say about grave threat to IAF bases in Ladakh & Arunachal Pradesh. I must say well done China for investing in indigenous MIC & sheer focus & support from Politburo & PLA along with a vast industrial base .

 

[shiphone]

T-7A Red Hawk

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both are powered by F404 and the jets' order/follow on orders are assured! so why GE had the problem to maintain the F404 manufacturing in the past years?

 

[Bhartiya Sainik]

??? never

PL17+PL15+PL12+PL10

-----------------

the export varient of fin foldable NEW PL15 AAM which fits for the Inner Weapon Bay was displayed last month...obviousely it is the matched option for the FC-31/J-35AE export...

View attachment 19879View attachment 19880View attachment 19881View attachment 19882

Folding fin on medium AAM????
I wonder why USA, EU don't have those with AIM-120, Meteor.
Russian R-77 grid fins can fold although, but Su-57 IWB has not been disclosed in this config.

 

[705-Lira]

On Tejas, scrap the follow up Mk1A order and fastrack Mk2, GE has supply chain issues with G404 engines anyway but the 414 line is always chugging at max capacity due to USN's own requirements and various other clients like SoKo. Redesign the ORCA with recessed bays and proper S curve DSI intakes (a KF-21 analogue) and force the IAF to collaborate on it Parrikar style, as a Su-30 replacement. Order 36 more Rafales to keep the IAF happy in the meanwhile. Development priority right now is AHCA>Tejas Mk2>ORCA.

Scrapping the follow on order for 97 Tejas Mk1A since these jets along with the existing order of 123 Tejas Mk1 + Mk1A are very much needed for air policing, interception & air defense missions.

Also the issues with the supply chain will be sorted out sooner rather than later since the GE Massachusetts facility that builds the F404 engines have restarted production and issues are close to being ironed out.

Tejas Mk2 is still 8-12 months away from prototype roll-out and it's highly unlikely to see it getting mass produced before 2029.
So in the short term, Tejas Mk1A is the only option to backfill falling numbers, the other being building more Su30 MKI which will require a new production line given that the Nashik assembly line has been repurposed to build Tejas.

 

[shade2]

Where's the roadmap to achieve 40 squadrons by 2032 or even arrest the fall of squadrons without MRFA?

@iNorthernerOn9 ask your Air Marshalls, this because nobody else, Priest King, Ninda Turtle or those faceless MoD Baboons have any clue.

It's almost as if force-preparedness should be the duty of the IAF but they were too busy stonewalling Tejas induction in hopes of big MMRCA import bonanza and today they are crying about declining squadrons

Anyway there is a cure for all this in buying F-16 via MRFA, Air Marshalls will be overjoyed, Tejas mk1a will be cancelled, Tejas mk2 will be smothered in the crib and Inshallah if America is impressed by our tail-wagging, we may even get F-35 and AMCA khatam, no Jhanjhat of GE F404 and GE F414 screwdrivergiri.

It's also why shill patrakars tell us that Dassault orderbooks are so full that they can only start delivering new planes in 2030

Other shills tell us that LM plans to double F16 production from the 2023's 24 planes a year to 40+ planes a year in the future WAOW!

How Many New F-16s Could Still Be Produced?

Hundreds of F-16s are likely to still be produced, with production to remain open for as long as demand exists.

simpleflying.com

Squadrons declining immediately staunched, Tejas all mk20730978315 totally btfo and AMCA canelled, multiple birds with one Made in America stone, literally (((everybody))) is happy.

Coming years are going to be awesome for dalals

 

[shade2]

Scrapping the follow on order for 97 Tejas Mk1A since these jets along with the existing order of 123 Tejas Mk1 + Mk1A are very much needed for air policing, interception & air defense missions.

Also the issues with the supply chain will be sorted out sooner rather than later since the GE Massachusetts facility that builds the F404 engines have restarted production and issues are close to being ironed out.

Tejas Mk2 is still 8-12 months away from prototype roll-out and it's highly unlikely to see it getting mass produced before 2029.
So in the short term, Tejas Mk1A is the only option to backfill falling numbers, the other being building more Su30 MKI which will require a new production line given that the Nashik assembly line has been repurposed to build Tejas.

Sure about that?



A new issue is taking office by next year, and he will try to leverage our current zaroorat -e- engine to score a few more DEALS

I do not see any future for any of our domestic programs except cancellation and full scale IMPOOOORT
and if America is the vendor for these Imports, you can expect no SCAM SCAM SCAM screechings from the opposition either.

Nobody wants domestic fighter jets, not the IAF, not the voting masses, not the babooze, Priest King can only push things along so much.

 

[shade2]

There will be no MRFA. IAF did not jointly negotiate with IN for more Rafales for this very reason.

The goal is simple for IAF. Beg, borrow and steal for F 35. They have made up their mind for around 40 F 35.

From 2023 :




https://www.cbsnews.com/news/f35-fighter-jets-aero-india-aviation-show-us-russia-weapons/

There will be an MRFA and the rebranded F-16 will (((win)))

The F-16 is ofc the pathway to the F35 afterall
Maybe...

 

[DumbPilot]

There will be an MRFA and the rebranded F-16 will (((win)))

The F-16 is ofc the pathway to the F35 afterall
Maybe...

extremely doubtful

 

[shade2]

extremely doubtful

Why?
They are screaming squadrons declining now, and patrakars rightly inform us that Dassault order books are full and a contract placed today will result in planes being acquired in 2030

So to stem the squadron decline, there is only one option, suddenly the "But the Pakis also have it" argument stops holding water...

And remember this is the only way that the IAF has a chance of getting those precious F-35s

 

[GodEmperorDoom]

Why?
They are screaming squadrons declining now, and patrakars rightly inform us that Dassault order books are full and a contract placed today will result in planes being acquired in 2030

So to stem the squadron decline, there is only one option, suddenly the "But the Pakis also have it" argument stops holding water...

And remember this is the only way that the IAF has a chance of getting those precious F-35s

Abey, How many times we had this conversation.
1. Great Satan isn't gonna give it to us.
2. If it allows, it comes at wallet busting price.
3. If it's cheaper, it comes with tons of restrictions with American Personnel on our bases.
4. Even with all such restrictions, you aren't gonna get anything more than 40 to 50 in some alternate fantasy.
5. Even in some alternate fantasy, if we get 100 F-35, they don't matter because by 2035 China will have 1000 J-20 and they don't need all of them, just field 200 here.

You can't put your own missiles, you can't make F-35 talk with AFNet, You can't do Networked Warfare neither can you integrate Loyal Wingman or Ghatak. Its as good as Monkey Piece for Genrols to show.

 

[RocketMan]

We'll probably be below 20 squadrons by 2030 . Bloody corrupt foreign maal khor IAF generaLols must be sacked . Heads must roll & accountability must be there .

 

[shade2]

Abey, How many times we had this conversation.
1. Great Satan isn't gonna give it to us.
2. If it allows, it comes at wallet busting price.
3. If it's cheaper, it comes with tons of restrictions with American Personnel on our bases.
4. Even with all such restrictions, you aren't gonna get anything more than 40 to 50 in some alternate fantasy.
5. Even in some alternate fantasy, if we get 100 F-35, they don't matter because by 2035 China will have 1000 J-20 and they don't need all of them, just field 200 here.

You can't put your own missiles, you can't make F-35 talk with AFNet, You can't do Networked Warfare neither can you integrate Loyal Wingman or Ghatak. Its as good as Monkey Piece for Genrols to show.

I'm talking about 114 F-16s being bought to "arrest squadron decline".
Genrols want F-35 also to "plug the gaps".

All your arguments are correct and even i agree but then our Genrols will play this "stonewalling Tejas/crying about declining squadrones/crying about no 5th gen fighter" game till the Govt gives up and allows their imports of choice or the Govt itself is changed and the favorite Democratic, Secular, Gandhian party of Chandigarh Lobby comes to power.

Previously their pasand -e- import was Rafale but not we won't even get all of those in 2-3 years but in the next decade, now the dalali will surely shift to F-16 which can deliver 24/year minimum and possibly more

 

[vin pahadi (kumauni)]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_People's_Liberation_Army_aircraft

again i will copy paste my previous post

Do Russians even have a a2a missile for su57, either way against j20 su57 has no chance, not only j20 has a lower rcs, it also probably have a better radar, chinkis also have devloped better a2a missiles then russia, su57 will just get bullied by j20.

yes they hv r77 bvr missile with 120 km range....beside this we were hearing their K77 bvr missile from 2020, which will hv 193 km range. dont know about its development.

Russia Unveils Dangerous New K-77 Air to Air Missile For Su-57 Fighter: What Makes it a Game Changer?

The first images of the new Russian K-77 air to air missile, heavily enhanced design based loosely on the R-77 currently in service, has been unveiled for the first time

militarywatchmagazine.com

beside this russian already developed 300-400 km range AWACS, tanker etc bigger aircraft destroyer BVR missile R37 M. but surprisingly we heard last year that one russian su35 kill down a mig 29 from 200-220 km range. although i dont know it can fit in su 57 internal bay or not.

Longest BVR Shot ? Russian R-37M Missile Intercepts Ukrainian MiG-29 – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

beside this no one can tell how effective one aircraft aesa radar nd other sensors against second aircraft. so dont know what is ur basis of judging that j20 radars r better than russian one. yes this is russia1-2 aesa radar (compare to many chinese aesa radars), but russia hv far better experience in ground based radars.

 

[shade2]

We'll probably be below 20 squadrons by 2030 . Bloody corrupt foreign maal khor IAF generaLols must be sacked . Heads must roll & accountability must be there .

Genrols not accountable to bloody civilians
Genrols also may do a coup like Shekhar Gupta's one fictional article
Genrols may also refuse to fight a DILLI CHALO mob like how Kangladesh Fauj did and Sheikh Hasina got regime changed

 

[GodEmperorDoom]

Genrols not accountable to bloody civilians
Genrols also may do a coup like Shekhar Gupta's one fictional article
Genrols may also refuse to fight a DILLI CHALO mob like how Kangladesh Fauj did and Sheikh Hasina got regime changed

Hence you got that Regimental System in Forces and Massive CRPF to control the masses.