Indian Air Force: News & Discussions (35 Viewers)

[redpanda]

They have saar.
We are only getting excuses from GE

>W-we had to restart the factory
>COVID supply chain issues

Doland is a deep state puppet

This is a continuation of the engine denial from Biden era.

In the first 2 years of Biden-raaj they were not giving Indians visas to the US in the same way, nothing was openly said but this was what they were doing.


Anyway nothing wrong with a snake biting, it is it's nature

The problem is our clowns being unserious about everything from Tejas to AMCA.

If they were serious they'd have contingencies or would have just gone with the good ole AL-31FP atleast for future projects.

But no, America ke saamne mujra karne me maza aata hai inko


Like I said just sign the deal for Rafale.

Don't forget this great Satan tried to kill many of its allies aviation industry a few time. And successfully killed Israel's jet fighter program on which the chinki J10C is based upon...

These guys wants us to buy their glorified baba samadam k jamane ka F-16. And which plane is in it's way? Tejas. Tejas chahiye to F21 aka repackaged F16 lena padega wala drama chala rahe honge. America don't want us to be self reliant because then they will lose a potential arms export market.

 

[FalconSlayers]

They have saar.
We are only getting excuses from GE

>W-we had to restart the factory
>COVID supply chain issues

Doland is a deep state puppet

This is a continuation of the engine denial from Biden era.

In the first 2 years of Biden-raaj they were not giving Indians visas to the US in the same way, nothing was openly said but this was what they were doing.


Anyway nothing wrong with a snake biting, it is it's nature

The problem is our clowns being unserious about everything from Tejas to AMCA.

If they were serious they'd have contingencies or would have just gone with the good ole AL-31FP atleast for future projects.

But no, America ke saamne mujra karne me maza aata hai inko


Like I said just sign the deal for Rafale.

"72 Rafale will cost $15 billion saar, you can get hundreds of Tejas in that cost"
~ Some Atmanirbhar MoD babu.

LoL I wonder how do these clowns remain in shortage of funds when the IAF fighter fleet is subpar for a supposed $4.3 trillion economy. SoKo with less than half of that has as many fighter jets as us, Israel has almost that many with 7-8 times smaller economy although with USA bankrolling them. Similar pattern for Turkey, Greece, or resident pakistan. SoKo has NoKo and PRC to deal with, despite american bases inland, same for Japan. Israel has all it's neighbours wanting it's genocide, what tf is this country doing while being surrounded by hostile countries heavily armed conventionally and with nukes?

Same is the story in AEW&CS, ISTAR, Strategic Airlifter, EW as well as Aerial Refueller procurement. And unlike PLAAF, USAF and RuAF, the IAF doesn't even have to spend on large bombers.

Total lack of seriousness in IAF.

 

[shade2]

G2G deals are double edged sword tbh. That's why govt isn't interested in it after our sour experience with the 2 squadron of Rafale purchased through G2G. MRFA is the way to go for them. They can do hagling by threatening to pick the competition there. More chance of successfully performing pressure tactics to make the french offer us better deal as per our terms. Waise ana to rafale ko hh hai jaise bhi.

You are very much aware of how much we have been scammed by the through the last G2G deal.

MFRA will take another 5 years minimum of chai biscoot trial and negotiation.
That is after the RFP starts, which will take a year for the merchants to submit their responses.

So 6 years minimum for contract signing

Then contract will be signed, then it will take like 2-3 years for them to start delivering

8 years for first plane.

This is ofc the minimum, optimistic timeline.

Frogs are already bending backwards for us with the Fuselage manufacturing at all it's a good time to place order for 72 with a FAL here.

Most importantly we have to put in in contract with strict penalties that they will integrate Astra-2, Gandiva and the Rudram series into Rafale.

 

[redpanda]

MFRA will take another 5 years minimum of chai biscoot trial and negotiation.
That is after the RFP starts, which will take a year for the merchants to submit their responses.

So 6 years minimum for contract signing

Then contract will be signed, then it will take like 2-3 years for them to start delivering

8 years for first plane.

This is ofc the minimum, optimistic timeline.

Frogs are already bending backwards for us with the Fuselage manufacturing at all it's a good time to place order for 72 with a FAL here.

Most importantly we have to put in in contract with strict penalties that they will integrate Astra-2, Gandiva and the Rudram series into Rafale.

They are supposedly planning to reduce that chai biscuit time to less than 2 years this year. So maybe our IAF babooz are putting their bet on this supposed reform. If they feel like nothing changed, then G2G will happen.

 

[shade2]

"72 Rafale will cost $15 billion saar, you can get hundreds of Tejas in that cost"
~ Some Atmanirbhar MoD babu.

LoL I wonder how do these clowns remain in shortage of funds when the IAF fighter fleet is subpar for a supposed $4.3 trillion economy. SoKo with less than half of that has as many fighter jets as us, Israel has almost that many with 7-8 times smaller economy although with USA bankrolling them. Similar pattern for Turkey, Greece, or resident pakistan. SoKo has NoKo and PRC to deal with, despite american bases inland, same for Japan. Israel has all it's neighbours wanting it's genocide, what tf is this country doing while being surrounded by hostile countries heavily armed conventionally and with nukes?

Same is the story in AEW&CS, ISTAR, Strategic Airlifter, EW as well as Aerial Refueller procurement. And unlike PLAAF, USAF and RuAF, the IAF doesn't even have to spend on large bombers.

Total lack of seriousness in IAF.

Oh that's not some MoD babu, that's the big guy himself

Imported UN AF has been stonewalling anything and everything domestic as much as possible

Chindi leadership and baboons are keeping the wallets of the nation totally shut.

The result is we have geriatric planes falling out of the sky inspite of brave pilots trying their best to salvage from what their citations say.

Jaguar,Mig29, Mirages all will have to be retired by 2030s.


It's not the matter of "muh besht teknologi,", "if imported wins wars then we have to import", it is now

KUCH BHI LELO RE BABA BUT KUCH LO TO SAHI

 

[redpanda]

Oh that's not some MoD babu, that's the big guy himself

Imported UN AF has been stonewalling anything and everything domestic as much as possible

Chindi leadership and baboons are keeping the wallets of the nation totally shut.

The result is we have geriatric planes falling out of the sky inspite of brave pilots trying their best to salvage from what their citations say.

Jaguar,Mig29, Mirages all will have to be retired by 2030s.


It's not the matter of "muh besht teknologi,", "if imported wins wars then we have to import", it is now

KUCH BHI LELO RE BABA BUT KUCH LO TO SAHI

I think we have to remember the Rafale negotiation is deeply connected with AMCA's engine as well. We very well know we can't rely on murican engines. So we somehow have to get the frenchs to co-develop a jet engine with us or atleast make them assemble their M88 engine here. There is certainly some work is going on behind the scene for that. Otherwise why would DA would be opening up such assemblies here. Some babooz in MoD are trying to hagle DA for as much as they can before both the deal are finalised.

 

[FalconSlayers]

they will lose a potential arms export market.

It's not about losing an arms market, that's secondary. Primary objective remains to create vassals by selling weapons on which you retain control. You can't integrate anything else on their platforms without paying them and with their permission, or maybe even if you offer money, they won't let you. Just a reminder the only reason we import and use Harpoon missiles and Mk54 torpedos is because our P8 Poseidons can only carry and fire them, not our torpedos and anti-ship missiles. So there you go, you sold them weapons, made money and created a vassal that can't turn against you even if it wants.

Want more? Apaches came costly because we had to import all weapons package with it as we can't use our own ATGMs on it, probably not even 70mm rockets if not the 30mm rounds. Same with the Predator drones, we're importing Hellfire missiles like we did for Apaches as we can't integrate our own on them and to do so will be a separate headache. Which is why these imports come very costly compared to our own systems which can integrate anything we have in our existing arsenal and you not necessarily have to buy more additional weapons for it. And you forever remain dependent on the supplier.

 

[shade2]

Don't forget this great Satan tried to kill many of its allies aviation industry a few time. And successfully killed Israel's jet fighter program on which the chinki J10C is based upon...

These guys wants us to buy their glorified baba samadam k jamane ka F-16. And which plane is in it's way? Tejas. Tejas chahiye to F21 aka repackaged F16 lena padega wala drama chala rahe honge. America don't want us to be self reliant because then they will lose a potential arms export market.

They also killed a Canadian fighter jet program, Japan, Italy and Germany being ww2 loser countries were never allowed to have their own programs, just buy from America yo!

It's not about losing an arms market, that's secondary. Primary objective remains to create vassals by selling weapons on which you retain control. You can't integrate anything else on their platforms without paying them and with their permission, or maybe even if you offer money, they won't let you. Just a reminder the only reason we import and use Harpoon missiles and Mk54 torpedos is because our P8 Poseidons can only carry and fire them, not our torpedos and anti-ship missiles. So there you go, you sold them weapons, made money and created a vassal that can't turn against you even if it wants.

Yes, this is why the Govt/Babooze avoid figher-jets, tanks, IFV( stryker KMKB ), ships and any other such bulk combat platforms from the Shaitan -e- Bozorg.

Basically anything which we use to actually fight is not bought from the Amerishart.

Knowing this proclivity it is peak retardation to stick with the GE F4x4 engines just because some uniformed guys say RUZZIAN INJIN BAD, 2MAINTAINANCE4ME, WESTERN INJIN IS BEST.

Oh btw these are not the French, whom you pay an amount after selling your kidney and they'll integrate whatever.

Only non-US weapons allowed on US platforms are mainly Israeli (((( of course oy vey ))) and a minority like ASSRAM, Spear3, IRIST from UK/MBDA/Europe etc are allowed

 

[shade2]

I feel the country is slowly moving towards Western/US vassaldom however, it will happen in 20 years, definitely before 2047.

It is not only laser eye's foreign settled spawn that we need to worry about.

 

[liberalredditor]

dolund and deep state want jaziya every month, first f404 then f414 then apache and chinook then mq9b the stryker then f21 then f15ex then this then that, but give them 100 billion usd and in return get excuses

 

[liberalredditor]

I feel the country is slowly moving towards Western/US vassaldom however, it will happen in 20 years, definitely before 2047.

It is not only laser eye's foreign settled spawn that we need to worry about.

its better to trust xhina than this burgerland

 

[shade2]

Want more? Apaches came costly because we had to import all weapons package with it as we can't use our own ATGMs on it, probably not even 70mm rockets if not the 30mm rounds. Same with the Predator drones, we're importing Hellfire missiles like we did for Apaches as we can't integrate our own on them and to do so will be a separate headache. Which is why these imports come very costly compared to our own systems which can integrate anything we have in our existing arsenal and you not necessarily have to buy more additional weapons for it. And you forever remain dependent on the supplier.

Oh btw this reminded me, the Amerisharts have some diabolic plans for our Indian Navy

After Cheen,SoKo, Japan we are the 4th most powerful navy in Asia.

Most mysteriously GE has supply chain issues for F404 engine and dances around for F414 contract signing

But they have no problems delivering LM2500 engines for Nilgiri frigates, INS Vikrant and NGMV in future

Amerisharts have problems delivering a measly 6 Apaches for the Army

But MH-60Rs are being delivered khata-khat, 13 already delivered out of 24 ordered.

Navy to commission up to 10 warships by December, led by first ASW Shallow-Water Craft ‘Arnala’

Marking the largest single commissioning of platforms in recent years, most vessels have been built domestically under strategic partnerships.

indianexpress.com

Against Cheen, they have gamed that whatever CBGs they can spare, the entire navies of JP and SK aren't enough, they want ours also to play a part

 

[FalconSlayers]

Oh btw this reminded me, the Amerisharts have some diabolic plans for our Indian Navy

After Cheen,SoKo, Japan we are the 4th most powerful navy in Asia.

Most mysteriously GE has supply chain issues for F404 engine and dances around for F414 contract signing

But they have no problems delivering LM2500 engines for Nilgiri frigates, INS Vikrant and NGMV in future

Amerisharts have problems delivering a measly 6 Apaches for the Army

But MH-60Rs are being delivered khata-khat, 13 already delivered out of 24 ordered.

Navy to commission up to 10 warships by December, led by first ASW Shallow-Water Craft ‘Arnala’

Marking the largest single commissioning of platforms in recent years, most vessels have been built domestically under strategic partnerships.

indianexpress.com

Against Cheen, they have gamed that whatever CBGs they can spare, the entire navies of JP and SK aren't enough, they want ours also to play a part

Not everything is a conspiracy theory bro, LM2500 engines have huge demand, like F414, they will remain in production. F404 went out of production due to no orders and restarting production is never easy.

Had IAF ordered Mk1A on time, engines would've been supplied like normal times. They didn't. A jet engine as a lot of suppliers supplying components and sub-assemblies required to make the gas turbine, and with F404 out of production, it's suppliers also stopped producing it's sub-components which again had to be restarted from scratch. Unless US Gov officially orders them to restrict anything, GE as a commercial corporate entity isn't likely going to be playing games with us.

 

[sameer]

They have saar.
We are only getting excuses from GE

>W-we had to restart the factory
>COVID supply chain issues

Doland is a deep state puppet

This is a continuation of the engine denial from Biden era.

In the first 2 years of Biden-raaj they were not giving Indians visas to the US in the same way, nothing was openly said but this was what they were doing.


Anyway nothing wrong with a snake biting, it is it's nature

The problem is our clowns being unserious about everything from Tejas to AMCA.

If they were serious they'd have contingencies or would have just gone with the good ole AL-31FP atleast for future projects.

But no, America ke saamne mujra karne me maza aata hai inko


Like I said just sign the deal for Rafale.

Saar, IAF/MOD procurement strategy is just pure and utter bullshitte. Any Indian engine maker if it ever existed would've gone bankrupt given how absolutely retarded IAF/MOD's procurement plan is.

They ordered:

10 engines in early 00's
17 engines in 2004
24 engines in 2007
and 99 engines in 2021, 14 freaking years later.

Batao kon prioritize karega aisi customer ko.

They even shut down the production line in 2016 because they thought there would be no future orders. It is one thing to produce tens of engines over a decade, and then commit to 15 to 20 engines a year.

Given the relatively small order batches and insane time gaps, it entirely makes sense that the Tejas variant simply isn't a priority for GE.

And ofc, this chindi govt neither will go full throttle with the kaveri nor get a deal signed with RR/Safran. So here we are..

 

[Brood Father]

HAL is good for nothing , wait by the end of this when they will deliver 1 airframe and blame the delay to sun , moon , constellation but never themselves..

 

[shade2]

Not everything is a conspiracy theory bro, LM2500 engines have huge demand, like F414, they will remain in production. F404 went out of production due to no orders and restarting production is never easy.

Had IAF ordered Mk1A on time, engines would've been supplied like normal times. They didn't. A jet engine as a lot of suppliers supplying components and sub-assemblies required to make the gas turbine, and with F404 out of production, it's suppliers also stopped producing it's sub-components which again had to be restarted from scratch. Unless US Gov officially orders them to restrict anything, GE as a commercial corporate entity isn't likely going to be playing games with us.

I am saying that but unofficially.

There is no paperwork, no official sanctions by US Congress or one of them ((( executive orders )))

All this is done unofficially, GE suits are persuaded by some glowies and other deep state appendages.

If the arms merchant suit-boots of US were given full freedom they'd sell us their whole catalog including F-35s since they love money so much but pretty much everywhere sarkar is stronger than dhandho.

Anyway your argument is also correct, Imported UN Airforce didn't want Tejas and so this could be the consequence of their strategic foot dragging on placing orders for it, time will tell.

Let's hope I am wrong because with the current trajectory we are fucked in the future if we can't make up the numbers, i am only talking about numbers and not muh Phipth Jen Stealth Teknologi.

Situation is so dire now that they'll be forced to gobble the much reviled "3 legged cheetah" too if it's available.

 

[FalconSlayers]

I am saying that but unofficially.

There is no paperwork, no official sanctions by US Congress or one of them ((( executive orders )))

All this is done unofficially, GE suits are persuaded by some glowies and other deep state appendages.

If the arms merchant suit-boots of US were given full freedom they'd sell us their whole catalog including F-35s since they love money so much but pretty much everywhere sarkar is stronger than dhandho.

Anyway your argument is also correct, Imported UN Airforce didn't want Tejas and so this could be the consequence of their strategic foot dragging on placing orders for it, time will tell.

Let's hope I am wrong because with the current trajectory we are fucked in the future if we can't make up the numbers, i am only talking about numbers and not muh Phipth Jen Stealth Teknologi.

Situation is so dire now that they'll be forced to gobble the much reviled "3 legged cheetah" too if it's available.

Bro, nearly most of our frontline warships rely on GE's gas turbines. Including our aircraft carrier, ever heard of delays by them? If HAL gets orders for 200 Mk2 and places orders for as many F414s, GE won't be delaying the supplies as it is still very much under production. It's IAF's fault at being unable to procure anything on time, probably drooling over imports, to the point it as of now has handful of indigenous equipment of any form, lowest among all three services arguably.

 

[shade2]

Bro, nearly most of our frontline warships rely on GE's gas turbines. Including our aircraft carrier, ever heard of delays by them? If HAL gets orders for 200 Mk2 and places orders for as many F414s, GE won't be delaying the supplies as it is still very much under production. It's IAF's fault at being unable to procure at time, probably drooling over imports, to the point is as of now has handful of indigenous equipment of any form, lowest among all three services arguably.

UN Import Marshalls have sadly won by doing this.

Govt can either do some cut the nose to spite the face stuff like going for another decade long MRFA drama and associated controversies

Or just G2G impoort Rafale or more Su-30( would be a much better option but marshalls want French onlee and Govt scared of CAATSA ).

Numbers are dropping and something has to be done, otherwise we'll end up only with 260 Su-30s and 36 Rafales in the near future

 

[sameer]

UN Import Marshalls have sadly won by doing this.

Govt can either do some cut the nose to spite the face stuff like going for another decade long MRFA drama and associated controversies

Or just G2G impoort Rafale or more Su-30( would be a much better option but marshalls want French onlee and Govt scared of CAATSA ).

Numbers are dropping and something has to be done, otherwise we'll end up only with 260 Su-30s and 36 Rafales in the near future

Purely from a cost perspective Rafale is just so insanely expensive. The naval wala deal costed us 63kcr for 26 planes of which 4 are trainers, the total cost aggregates to around ~$280M per plane. I know that includes some spares, weapons, other stuff wagera also, but its so crazy.. Imho, Even F5 Rafale is not worth that much.

But it looks like we don't really have any alternatives. Decisions have already been made. We will have to keep funding the pensions and month long annual vacays of those Dassault employees till 2040's.

Our AF is in such a bad position that I don't even know what to say sometimes.

 

[redpanda]

I feel the country is slowly moving towards Western/US vassaldom however, it will happen in 20 years, definitely before 2047.

It is not only laser eye's foreign settled spawn that we need to worry about.

I mean we were almost a vassaldom under moraji, gujral, etc like CIA ajunts. But we recovered from that state similar to how Russia recovered under Putya. So I think the vassaldom depends on the leadership of the day. They will eventually will be able to install one of their puppet as PM. But then somebody else will come and try to again be sovereign. It's a long diplomatic game..the reason we are sovereign is because there are certainly a faction among our policy makers which prefer sovereignty of India for one reason or another. Not everyone is an US dalla or have been compromised yet. As long as such peoples are there, we will try to still maintain some sovereignty just like the frenchs (who even though in NATO tends to be very defiant of Unkil Sam).