Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

Azaad said:

View: https://twitter.com/AdithyaKM_/status/1896038485926273405?s=19

This is what happens when you shoot your mouth off too much in public. Discerning people who've been following developments in this field for ages aren't fooled so easily nor get swayed by emotions. Instead they start asking rational questions like Somnath Mukherjee did & now Aditya is , to which the IAF has no answers.

As I remarked earlier, if a post mortem of the past 2.5 decades is held, nobody will emerge clean from it. Neither HAL, nor DRDO / ADA or IAF nor least of all the MoD / GoI.
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Somnath Mukherjee is a nobody
Adtiya KM is a nobody
You and me and everyone on this forum are nobodies

HAL is the DPSU equivalent of a nobody :bplease: , they are only somebodies and total babbar shers in terms of preserving their employment but not for other things

So it doesn't matter, there are many Dalal Patrakar articles out there cheerleading the utterances and doing "Do you know more than the ACM, you bloody civilian who has never flown a plane in his life" in order to manufacture consensus of "HAL BAD" in the minds of the clueless masses.

See, everyone is on the same page, MoD babooze, Govt, IAF, shill "journalists" and for now opposition and PIL/RTI filing ecosystem also.

Expose hote rahenge on Twitter, Import Bahadurs will keep on getting ratio'd, questions will be asked but kuch badlega nahi.

To deter China and by that to strengthen GoI's hand in dealing with them diplomatically we need a strong domestic MIC.
That needs co-operation from everyone involved, mostly from the users, but they are not interested, kya faida.

Anyway they'll get what they want, mk1a orders and mk2 mwf program will be cancelled to pay for the MRFA, two birds with one stone.
 
Migflug said:

View: https://x.com/nssdatta/status/1896598610403529090?t=bRZjyfO6OLnXXP9vtCNdhQ&s=19


View: https://x.com/nssdatta/status/1896598679538323614?t=YjC1GgTDDUDuKOjpFEV4EQ&s=19
Click to expand...

Frankly whoever's handling the PR in DRDO ought to be kicked first & then sacked. You just held the most high profile event in 2 years at Bangalore with AI 2025 & instead of exhibiting these wares there for foreign & Indian participants to show off our prowess , they go off to Hyderabad a few days after the grand event is over in what I bet must be a low key low publicised event over there .

There're literally no national media covering this important exhibition with defence aficionados being caught flat footed in the sense that nobody knew this was scheduled to be held in Hyderabad.

Don't get me wrong . The local Telugu channels may have surely covered it well & defence aficionados from Tlg & AP may have attended it apart from the students who surely must have had their curiosity kindled but the entire exhibition in my opinion proved to be counter productive in light of the fact that there was little to no publicity of this event.
 

View: https://x.com/rajatpTOI/status/1896765733226574264?t=B0GcPCgrLc8v0ClxIGlq4Q&s=19

The “key thrust areas” identified in the report range from progressively increasing the number of fighter squadrons, which is currently down to just 30 despite a sanctioned strength of 42.5, to induction of additional “force-enablers” like airborne early-warning and control (AEW&C) aircraft and mid-air refuelers as well as a wide array of air-to-air and surface-to-air missiles

The report presented on Monday has detailed a “glide path” to increasing the number of fighter squadrons, which includes a foreign OEM (original equipment manufacturer) tying up with an Indian partner to set up a production line here.
While HAL’s three production lines for the light-weight Tejas will continue, this will be a parallel production line for a different medium-weight fighter,” another official said. This involves the long-pending project to manufacture 114 new 4.5-generation fighters, at an initial estimate of Rs 1.25 lakh crore, with foreign collaboration
 
Migflug said:

View: https://x.com/rajatpTOI/status/1896765733226574264?t=B0GcPCgrLc8v0ClxIGlq4Q&s=19

The “key thrust areas” identified in the report range from progressively increasing the number of fighter squadrons, which is currently down to just 30 despite a sanctioned strength of 42.5, to induction of additional “force-enablers” like airborne early-warning and control (AEW&C) aircraft and mid-air refuelers as well as a wide array of air-to-air and surface-to-air missiles

The report presented on Monday has detailed a “glide path” to increasing the number of fighter squadrons, which includes a foreign OEM (original equipment manufacturer) tying up with an Indian partner to set up a production line here.
While HAL’s three production lines for the light-weight Tejas will continue, this will be a parallel production line for a different medium-weight fighter,” another official said. This involves the long-pending project to manufacture 114 new 4.5-generation fighters, at an initial estimate of Rs 1.25 lakh crore, with foreign collaboration
Click to expand...

What more do you expect from babus? I don't think government agrees to this.
 
shade2 said:
They are obsessed with getting 100+ Rafale at any cost
so they block Tejas induction and maintain a hands-off entitled customer vs incompetent vendor( HAL ) approach.

GoI was fixated till now to push Tejas on them because it would be cheaper and non-controversial politically.
So they just sit on the MRFA file and don't do any further G2G for Rafale.

End result if squadrons keep on declining, missile & radar-maxxxing is also not done to atleast staunch the loss of capability from declining fighter numbers, very precarious and dangerous situation

Chronology basically is, from what i've read

>IAF acquires Mirage 2000 to counter PAF getting F16 in the 80s
>Massive Trouser-shivering occurs in Moscow
>IAF wants to have 100 Mirages domestically assembled in India with Tee Oh Tee ofc
>Frenchies do their usual nakhra
>Ruskals come with a whole buffet of MiGs, ToT, Local production what have you
>These MiGs acquired in succession ending with MiG 29
>That infamous jet ofc has it's own saga, IAF realizes Ruskies bamboozled them
>Kargil happens
>IAF impressed with Mirage performance, wants more
>MMRCA happens
>Frenchies say Mirage is out of production, buy Rafale

Tejas doesn't figure in this at all because it was just a sarkari """" science project """" to keep DRDO and HAL boys employed, same as Tejas MK2/MWF and AMCA today, IAF has no interest in inducting it or the others mentioned, current Tejas progress is only because Parrikar did arm twisting on his end, but otherwise Tejas is just a """"three legged cheetah"""" forced upon them.

Only obstacle towards the goal of Rafale( and since 6th gen Ching Dorito is flying, it's F-35 also ) was the Govt, and now even they are onboard now provided it's through the MRFA tender from what we see.

ADA should be disbanded, HAL can anyway get half or more of any MRFA 🪛 contract work, since they will never be able to deliver """"Mk1A"""", engine or no engine. :troll:

If the users themselves don't want your jets, what's the point? :bplease: Better just cancel Tejas/Tejas MWF/AMCA, other DRDO /DPSU employment yojanas can be created.
Click to expand...
you just forget one step in the Mirage 2000 history : The assembly line was to sell in mid 2000. But as always you didn't decide and the line was scrapped.
You lost a rare opportunity.
 
Azaad said:

View: https://youtu.be/sVnzubW0dRo?si=f3dFpSMTe4RURTVC

To all those who're interested in the history of the IAF & HAL , especially with a view on the various developmental programs they've conducted from the Marut , before & since , I strongly recommend this program.

The narrator frequently laments the thorough neglect to documenting all these endeavours along with the mistakes made for these can serve as a reminder for future programs.
Click to expand...

Indian Air Force : What did we missed ???

just to decide...
 
BON PLAN said:
Indian Air Force : What did we missed ???

just to decide...
Click to expand...
Did you see the program or did you just feel the need to troll ? Besides are we to assume the armee de l'air never ever committed any mistakes throughout its existence ?
 
Migflug said:

View: https://x.com/livefist/status/1896566902698500242?t=2ZV-5-jnlE6K3mH4OteGUA&s=19


View: https://x.com/livefist/status/1896568757532942838?t=UdV473ejCXI8aIaqSJ2J8A&s=19
Click to expand...

Entire Tejas MK1A LRU is manufactured by Private companies. HAL is an lead integrator. Basically it does not change anything even if HAL is replaced as lead integrator. Since the LRU will come from same vendors. and now new company will do the assembly. HAL screwed up due to Engine fiasco. Otherwise it should have completed them in time.

Most point of concern will be the HAL lethargic response to Dhruv crashes and lack of transparency in fixing the problem. This is something needs to fixed up. Again this happens due to HAL being DPSU. Recent example like Boeing who ruined their reputation by doing serious quality lapse. So it applies to the same Private lead Integrator.


Azaad said:
Frankly whoever's handling the PR in DRDO ought to be kicked first & then sacked. You just held the most high profile event in 2 years at Bangalore with AI 2025 & instead of exhibiting these wares there for foreign & Indian participants to show off our prowess , they go off to Hyderabad a few days after the grand event is over in what I bet must be a low key low publicised event over there .

There're literally no national media covering this important exhibition with defence aficionados being caught flat footed in the sense that nobody knew this was scheduled to be held in Hyderabad.

Don't get me wrong . The local Telugu channels may have surely covered it well & defence aficionados from Tlg & AP may have attended it apart from the students who surely must have had their curiosity kindled but the entire exhibition in my opinion proved to be counter productive in light of the fact that there was little to no publicity of this event.
Click to expand...


It looks like an small amount event by DRDO. They just done in Hyderabad itself. RM as chief guest is expected. But the bigger picture. They showcase some really cutting edge missiles out of nowhere.

They become chads suddenly.
 
ArjunMK1A said:
Entire Tejas MK1A LRU is manufactured by Private companies. HAL is an lead integrator. Basically it does not change anything even if HAL is replaced as lead integrator. Since the LRU will come from same vendors. and now new company will do the assembly. HAL screwed up due to Engine fiasco. Otherwise it should have completed them in time.

Most point of concern will be the HAL lethargic response to Dhruv crashes and lack of transparency in fixing the problem. This is something needs to fixed up. Again this happens due to HAL being DPSU. Recent example like Boeing who ruined their reputation by doing serious quality lapse. So it applies to the same Private lead Integrator.
Click to expand...
Precisely why this approach should've been followed when developing an alternative to HAL instead of the SPV floated for AMCA by MoD waiting for nearly 3 years before they got the GoI to sanction funds for the development of the AMCA.

There are talks of increasing the quantum of Mk-2 to some 300+ nos now from the original 108 nos. We can follow the same model if integration of 97 nos Mk-1a proves successful assuming it's handed over to a pvt player instead of pie in the sky schemes like choosing a Pvt Sector Player as lead integrator for as prestigious & sensitive a program as the AMCA with zero experience whatsoever in the aviation industry like they were previously pursuing.
ArjunMK1A said:
It looks like an small amount event by DRDO. They just done in Hyderabad itself. RM as chief guest is expected. But the bigger picture. They showcase some really cutting edge missiles out of nowhere.

They become chads suddenly.
Click to expand...
The issue was always the publicity around the event especially when they chose to exhibit their crown jewels that too in an extremely low profile event in Hyderabad instead of displaying them at AI -25.

They could've done so at Hyderabad too but with the right publicity. All they could've done was copied HAL in how the latter went about organising the AI-25.

I'd go one step further & ask why didn't they offer to co host AI-25 assuming such a thing was possible ( I personally don't think HAL would be inclined to co host AI ) . Think of the amount of free publicity they'd attract especially coverage from foreign participants with the HGV , BM-05 , Pralay , Agni -V , etc .
 
Migflug said:

View: https://x.com/rajatpTOI/status/1896765733226574264?t=B0GcPCgrLc8v0ClxIGlq4Q&s=19

The “key thrust areas” identified in the report range from progressively increasing the number of fighter squadrons, which is currently down to just 30 despite a sanctioned strength of 42.5, to induction of additional “force-enablers” like airborne early-warning and control (AEW&C) aircraft and mid-air refuelers as well as a wide array of air-to-air and surface-to-air missiles

The report presented on Monday has detailed a “glide path” to increasing the number of fighter squadrons, which includes a foreign OEM (original equipment manufacturer) tying up with an Indian partner to set up a production line here.
While HAL’s three production lines for the light-weight Tejas will continue, this will be a parallel production line for a different medium-weight fighter,” another official said. This involves the long-pending project to manufacture 114 new 4.5-generation fighters, at an initial estimate of Rs 1.25 lakh crore, with foreign collaboration
Click to expand...


Users :-
>SQUADRONES DECLINING SAAARS!!!!!
>NEED TO INDUCT 40 AC A YEAR TO REBUILD STRENGTH!

Baboos & GoI :-
>"Yes, let us play 5-6 years of trial-trial, chai-biscoot negotiation and tender-tender for 114 Imported fighter jets"
 
Migflug said:

View: https://x.com/rajatpTOI/status/1896765733226574264?t=B0GcPCgrLc8v0ClxIGlq4Q&s=19

The “key thrust areas” identified in the report range from progressively increasing the number of fighter squadrons, which is currently down to just 30 despite a sanctioned strength of 42.5, to induction of additional “force-enablers” like airborne early-warning and control (AEW&C) aircraft and mid-air refuelers as well as a wide array of air-to-air and surface-to-air missiles

The report presented on Monday has detailed a “glide path” to increasing the number of fighter squadrons, which includes a foreign OEM (original equipment manufacturer) tying up with an Indian partner to set up a production line here.
While HAL’s three production lines for the light-weight Tejas will continue, this will be a parallel production line for a different medium-weight fighter,” another official said. This involves the long-pending project to manufacture 114 new 4.5-generation fighters, at an initial estimate of Rs 1.25 lakh crore, with foreign collaboration
Click to expand...

If GoI is thinking of setting up another line this time in the form of a collaboration between a Pvt Sector player & a Foreign OEM & spend the equivalent of 25-30 billion USD not the 15 billion USD as given there which is an outdated figure from the previous decade , they ought to ask themselves how do they plan to go about it ?

Thru the tender route or the G2G route as in built into this equation is the time required for the entire process to be undertaken followed by the time required to execute the contract in full. The former itself will take a good 5-6 years followed by at least 10 years to execute the full contract & this is an optimistic assessment.

All this doesn't take into account what happens if we go up against the Chinese in the next 4-5 years for that's the only reason this requirement exists otherwise what we currently possess & what's in the pipeline is more than enough to cater to the Paxtanis in the present & the future.

Unfortunately , this is what happens when we don't undertake a stitch in time. We're already facing a ridiculous situation w.r.t the IN where we've signed a contract for 3 additional Scorpenes , are pursuing 6 nos vide Project 75 I followed by our indigenous 6 nos vide Project 76 & then there's the SSN project for 2 SSN which is a preliminary requirement of a total of 6 such submarines.

If we pursue this requirement we'd see in the next decade 83 nos Mk-1a + 97 nos Mk-1a , 108 nos Mk-2 , 40 nos AMCA Mk-1 to be executed thru an assortment of DPSU & Pvt Sector Players plus 114 nos MRFA . There's a very high chance we could see a bump up in the numbers of LCA Mk-2 & AMCA Mk-1 which could be affected if we were to go in for the foreign MRFA route.

Further there's the development of the AMCA Mk-2 , TEDBF & possibly a 6th Gen FA & a possible 5th Gen FA Naval FA .
 
Azaad said:
If GoI is thinking of setting up another line this time in the form of a collaboration between a Pvt Sector player & a Foreign OEM & spend the equivalent of 25-30 billion USD not the 15 billion USD as given there which is an outdated figure from the previous decade , they ought to ask themselves how do they plan to go about it ?

Thru the tender route or the G2G route as in built into this equation is the time required for the entire process to be undertaken followed by the time required to execute the contract in full. The former itself will take a good 5-6 years followed by at least 10 years to execute the full contract & this is an optimistic assessment.

All this doesn't take into account what happens if we go up against the Chinese in the next 4-5 years for that's the only reason this requirement exists otherwise what we currently possess & what's in the pipeline is more than enough to cater to the Paxtanis in the present & the future.

Unfortunately , this is what happens when we don't undertake a stitch in time. We're already facing a ridiculous situation w.r.t the IN where we've signed a contract for 3 additional Scorpenes , are pursuing 6 nos vide Project 75 I followed by our indigenous 6 nos vide Project 76 & then there's the SSN project for 2 SSN which is a preliminary requirement of a total of 6 such submarines.

If we pursue this requirement we'd see in the next decade 83 nos Mk-1a + 97 nos Mk-1a , 108 nos Mk-2 , 40 nos AMCA Mk-1 to be executed thru an assortment of DPSU & Pvt Sector Players plus 114 nos MRFA . There's a very high chance we could see a bump up in the numbers of LCA Mk-2 & AMCA Mk-1 which could be affected if we were to go in for the foreign MRFA route.

Further there's the development of the AMCA Mk-2 , TEDBF & possibly a 6th Gen FA & a possible 5th Gen FA Naval FA .
Click to expand...
If we're going for foreign jet in mrfa, it's much better to go directly for 100+ su57( the twin seater configuration) and merge that deal with future jet engine deal for su30mki.
 
Azaad said:
If GoI is thinking of setting up another line this time in the form of a collaboration between a Pvt Sector player & a Foreign OEM & spend the equivalent of 25-30 billion USD not the 15 billion USD as given there which is an outdated figure from the previous decade , they ought to ask themselves how do they plan to go about it ?

Thru the tender route or the G2G route as in built into this equation is the time required for the entire process to be undertaken followed by the time required to execute the contract in full. The former itself will take a good 5-6 years followed by at least 10 years to execute the full contract & this is an optimistic assessment.

All this doesn't take into account what happens if we go up against the Chinese in the next 4-5 years for that's the only reason this requirement exists otherwise what we currently possess & what's in the pipeline is more than enough to cater to the Paxtanis in the present & the future.

Unfortunately , this is what happens when we don't undertake a stitch in time. We're already facing a ridiculous situation w.r.t the IN where we've signed a contract for 3 additional Scorpenes , are pursuing 6 nos vide Project 75 I followed by our indigenous 6 nos vide Project 76 & then there's the SSN project for 2 SSN which is a preliminary requirement of a total of 6 such submarines.

If we pursue this requirement we'd see in the next decade 83 nos Mk-1a + 97 nos Mk-1a , 108 nos Mk-2 , 40 nos AMCA Mk-1 to be executed thru an assortment of DPSU & Pvt Sector Players plus 114 nos MRFA . There's a very high chance we could see a bump up in the numbers of LCA Mk-2 & AMCA Mk-1 which could be affected if we were to go in for the foreign MRFA route.

Further there's the development of the AMCA Mk-2 , TEDBF & possibly a 6th Gen FA & a possible 5th Gen FA Naval FA .
Click to expand...

It is for MRFA only, if they were serious they would have gone for another G2G with le Francais for 36 or 54 Rafale with some additional fees for them prioritizing deliveries by assigning Armee de l'Air production slots for us.

Do you remember this article? 👇 the main point here is the GoI wants to go for a """" non controversial procurement"""""

i.e To prevent issues like pic related happening again with another G2G deal
1741080887949.webp

So you can imagine since every ((( procedure ))) will be followed for a """" clean """" procurement, so as to no keechad is flung on Topji's teflon coated image, how many years this will take, possibly more than a decade.

Maybe Topji won't even be in power by then.


Now the users, since they keep singing the same tune from the past 3 or more years, you would assume they would be willing to induct a certain "three legged cheetah" and "mig21+++++++" in good numbers to make up for the shortfall, but even that won't be done, the same games as usual will be played, perhaps "Not Mk1A" will become outdated and a new set of requirements will be produced.

Let us hope that missile and radar maxxing is being done, that's the only thing we can do, rest all is just delays and bureaucracy and back-and-forth.
J-20 and J-35 must be welcomed by a hail of missiles whenever they come in the next 4-5 years.
 
randombully said:
If we're going for foreign jet in mrfa, it's much better to go directly for 100+ su57( the twin seater configuration) and merge that deal with future jet engine deal for su30mki.
Click to expand...
shade2 said:
It is for MRFA only, if they were serious they would have gone for another G2G with le Francais for 36 or 54 Rafale with some additional fees for them prioritizing deliveries by assigning Armee de l'Air production slots for us.

Do you remember this article? 👇 the main point here is the GoI wants to go for a """" non controversial procurement"""""

i.e To prevent issues like pic related happening again with another G2G deal
View attachment 26637

So you can imagine since every ((( procedure ))) will be followed for a """" clean """" procurement, so as to no keechad is flung on Topji's teflon coated image, how many years this will take, possibly more than a decade.

Maybe Topji won't even be in power by then.


Now the users, since they keep singing the same tune from the past 3 or more years, you would assume they would be willing to induct a certain "three legged cheetah" and "mig21+++++++" in good numbers to make up for the shortfall, but even that won't be done, the same games as usual will be played, perhaps "Not Mk1A" will become outdated and a new set of requirements will be produced.

Let us hope that missile and radar maxxing is being done, that's the only thing we can do, rest all is just delays and bureaucracy and back-and-forth.
J-20 and J-35 must be welcomed by a hail of missiles whenever they come in the next 4-5 years.
Click to expand...
If the entire issue is sought to be mitigated thru revival of the MRFA tender then that could've been done in 2021 itself as ACM Chaudhari demanded which led to a public spat with the then CDS Gen Rawat who along with the MoD were in favour of a piece meal acquisition a la the MKIs.

Why were 3 years wasted? Besides as per latest assessments the F4 version of the Rafales are deemed inadequate to go up against the J-20s from what I understand based on various reports to the same on SM.

The definitive version of the Rafales which would be able to do so is the F-5 whose upgradation was due in 2025 but has now been postponed to 2030 & later. But this again can be countered by - what happens when China deploys their 6th Gen FAs? This is also assuming that the VLO J-20 won't see much upgradation to its capabilities for the next 10 years since remember we're comparing the capabilities of the J-20 as it exists today to the Rafale F5 when it comes next decade.

I don't think the Su-57 stands a chance for the simple reason it's still WiP - work in progress & will mature only towards the end of this decade or early next decade. The IAF after burning its fingers multiple times has as a matter of policy chosen not to consider such platforms which is the reason they're not too enthusiastic about the F-35 else constraints apart the latter is a much better platform than the Su-57 which at best is a LO quasi 5th Gen FA.

Had we not gone in for the Rafales, the Su-57 would make a great addition. In its present form it brings little value to the IAF. I'd extend that argument to most of Russian platforms except their N Submarines & a few other exceptions.

In the meanwhile you're seeing frantic attempts by our armed forces to come up with solutions to detect stealth like the system of systems by networking the IA, IN & IAF networks along with all civilian radar systems, radars for weather monitoring & production, including the various cell phone radars etc.

Further they've also just come up with anti stealth radars - the first batch of which has been handed over to the armed forces. Then there's our procurement of the Russian Voronezh radar systems. The efficacy of these radar systems is moot but in the absence of a 5th Gen FA & our bureaucratic system which are more an impediment than an enabler , we're trying our best to come up with a solution to a vexing problem.
 
Azaad said:
If the entire issue is sought to be mitigated thru revival of the MRFA tender then that could've been done in 2021 itself as ACM Chaudhari demanded which led to a public spat with the then CDS Gen Rawat who along with the MoD were in favour of a piece meal acquisition a la the MKIs.

Why were 3 years wasted? Besides as per latest assessments the F4 version of the Rafales are deemed inadequate to go up against the J-20s from what I understand based on various reports to the same on SM.

The definitive version of the Rafales which would be able to do so is the F-5 whose upgradation was due in 2025 but has now been postponed to 2030 & later. But this again can be countered by - what happens when China deploys their 6th Gen FAs? This is also assuming that the VLO J-20 won't see much upgradation to its capabilities for the next 10 years since remember we're comparing the capabilities of the J-20 as it exists today to the Rafale F5 when it comes next decade.

I don't think the Su-57 stands a chance for the simple reason it's still WiP - work in progress & will mature only towards the end of this decade or early next decade. The IAF after burning its fingers multiple times has as a matter of policy chosen not to consider such platforms which is the reason they're not too enthusiastic about the F-35 else constraints apart the latter is a much better platform than the Su-57 which at best is a LO quasi 5th Gen FA.

Had we not gone in for the Rafales, the Su-57 would make a great addition. In its present form it brings little value to the IAF. I'd extend that argument to most of Russian platforms except their N Submarines & a few other exceptions.

In the meanwhile you're seeing frantic attempts by our armed forces to come up with solutions to detect stealth like the system of systems by networking the IA, IN & IAF networks along with all civilian radar systems, radars for weather monitoring & production, including the various cell phone radars etc.

Further they've also just come up with anti stealth radars - the first batch of which has been handed over to the armed forces. Then there's our procurement of the Russian Voronezh radar systems. The efficacy of these radar systems is moot but in the absence of a 5th Gen FA & our bureaucratic system which are more an impediment than an enabler , we're trying our best to come up with a solution to a vexing problem.
Click to expand...
Except f35.
Su57 is the most advanced and capable platform we can buy.
It may struggle against j20( sy57 is the least stealthy 5th gen out there), but it will mop the floor against any non stealth chinese fighter.
Will also be the most capable SEAD and deep penetration fighter in our arsenal till amca if we buy.
So while lacking in stealth comparing to other 5th gen, but lot more stealthy than any 4.5 gen airframe.
It's a better purchase than rafale.
And russia can participate in mrfa like other contenders
 
Azaad said:
If the entire issue is sought to be mitigated thru revival of the MRFA tender then that could've been done in 2021 itself as ACM Chaudhari demanded which led to a public spat with the then CDS Gen Rawat who along with the MoD were in favour of a piece meal acquisition a la the MKIs.

Why were 3 years wasted? Besides as per latest assessments the F4 version of the Rafales are deemed inadequate to go up against the J-20s from what I understand based on various reports to the same on SM.

The definitive version of the Rafales which would be able to do so is the F-5 whose upgradation was due in 2025 but has now been postponed to 2030 & later. But this again can be countered by - what happens when China deploys their 6th Gen FAs? This is also assuming that the VLO J-20 won't see much upgradation to its capabilities for the next 10 years since remember we're comparing the capabilities of the J-20 as it exists today to the Rafale F5 when it comes next decade.

I don't think the Su-57 stands a chance for the simple reason it's still WiP - work in progress & will mature only towards the end of this decade or early next decade. The IAF after burning its fingers multiple times has as a matter of policy chosen not to consider such platforms which is the reason they're not too enthusiastic about the F-35 else constraints apart the latter is a much better platform than the Su-57 which at best is a LO quasi 5th Gen FA.

Had we not gone in for the Rafales, the Su-57 would make a great addition. In its present form it brings little value to the IAF. I'd extend that argument to most of Russian platforms except their N Submarines & a few other exceptions.

In the meanwhile you're seeing frantic attempts by our armed forces to come up with solutions to detect stealth like the system of systems by networking the IA, IN & IAF networks along with all civilian radar systems, radars for weather monitoring & production, including the various cell phone radars etc.

Further they've also just come up with anti stealth radars - the first batch of which has been handed over to the armed forces. Then there's our procurement of the Russian Voronezh radar systems. The efficacy of these radar systems is moot but in the absence of a 5th Gen FA & our bureaucratic system which are more an impediment than an enabler , we're trying our best to come up with a solution to a vexing problem.
Click to expand...

imo IAF and Sarkar's full focus should be on missile radar maxxing, this MRFA pass the file business can be left to the bureaucrats.

Kuch bhi karlo none of these imported fighters will appear in good quantities before 5 years, User doesn't want Tejas or any other DRDO/HAL product even to stop squadron strength failing, so only option left is SAM & Radar
 
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Unknowncommando
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Dassault Rafale in Indian Air Force
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