LCA TEJAS MK-I & MK-IA: News and Discussion

Get over it. Develop a thicker skin.
You too understand very well why he is saying the chief as Canadian.
Im afraid the what will come next from such crooked mind
PS: not so long ago same gupt rogis were claiming suerpowa status because apparently buying few French 4th gen fighters and different arms from different insignificant countries makes India supapawa
 
Whole developing world's MIC aim towards low hanging fruits first. Meanwhile Jurnail.

View: https://x.com/sakthivel_cit93/status/1876638758768136567

I think if there were any doubts ( there shouldn't have been any if one goes by the record ) that the IAF is intensely dissatisfied with HAL then there's no bigger or better conclusive evidence as it is known in judicial parlance than this speech by the ACM - IAF.

I don't think the GoI disagrees with it too yet what came out of it ? GoI waited 2-3 years after declaring AMCA would be fabricated by the Pvt Sector ( wrong move IMO) then agreed to a JV with HAL & now AMCA is the sole preserve of HAL.

That's not the way GoI ought to go about it . You can't honestly expect a complete novice to suddenly get into 5th Gen FA mfg / assembly . It's too complex even for an entity like HAL which has been in the business for nearly 80+ years . Whatever your misgivings they're the best & more to the point the ONLY bet you have .

Rather , the GoI should've tasked MoD to seek both external & internal consultancy to split up HAL into the following constituents to maximize value -

A unit to solely look into development & mfg of hptrs.

A unit to be merged with NAL & be tasked to develop civilian airliners & military transport planes much like EMBRAER .

A unit to be merged with GTRE as the design house to develop & mfg TurboShafts , TurboFans , TurboJets , etc & finally

HAL whose remit must be ONLY development & mfg of FAs , MALE / HALE UAVs etc with the aim of also becoming a mfg agency for ISRO since the future of Aerospace now lies in unmanned systems & increasing convergence with space based tech & applications.

GoI must divest it's stake in HAL & these constituents such that each of these constituents have cross holdings in each other which along with GoI's stake ensures the majority shareholder will always be the GoI.

This is important for the purpose of establishing ownership. The rest of the shares must be with the public. It needs to be something on the lines of really professional PSU's like NTPC or BPCL but with more autonomy in operations & more importantly decision making.

The next step should be to task HAL with developing a professional leadership. This is vital for the longevity & prosperity of HAL otherwise long term there will be no HAL. HAL as it exists today is simply too unwieldy an organisation with no focus into multiple areas with no core competencies besides being imbued with the culture typical of most if not all PSU's.

RN with the kind of bad press it is getting I'm afraid the moment an opportunity presents itself as an alternative to HAL , both IAF & GoI ( not MoD ) will pursue it zealously thus ignoring HAL & the many issues plaguing it - some of which I've listed above , not all of it is of HAL's doing. With the result there's a real danger of throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

I could go on . Trust people here have got the gist .
 
Whole developing world's MIC aim towards low hanging fruits first. Meanwhile Jurnail.

View: https://x.com/sakthivel_cit93/status/1876638758768136567

Will those 5 manufacturers agree to sell you the bespoke technologies in the first place.

Atleast IAF seems to be moving to Stage 5 now.

images
 


>Many IAF officers tried their best to scuttle LCA. Even the Chief was advised by them not to get involved with project. IAF officer who was overseeing project on deputation to HAL was harassed & denied promotion

:rage:

On the previous page i gave a large sermon about how the "Navy Model" should be applied to Genrol & Marshol.

I forgot that the Navy Model only works because in terms of institutional culture all Admirals and Commodores are on the same page to do the most with what little budget they get, which is why they design/build ships locally at the bare minimum.

OTOH the "institutional culture" on the other side is to be salesmen for Russian, Israeli, American and French gear. :facepalm4:

I always wonder we would be in a much better position both in terms of squadron numbers( 200+ Tejas ) and tech development if Marshols would have given #FullSupport to HAL/DRDO boys in Tejas development including Kaveri.
 


Makes me think if they were ever even working with ADA to hash out the requirements. If the end user doesn't even want to get involved , then how the hell do you even design a product for them.

But how did we get to that point though? I want to understand the psychology behind why our colonial generols behave like this?

I kno they want visa for their kids yada yada and other stuff. But there has to be some concrete reason for such levels of disinterest?
 
Makes me think if they were ever even working with ADA to hash out the requirements. If the end user doesn't even want to get involved , then how the hell do you even design a product for them.

But how did we get to that point though? I want to understand the psychology behind why our colonial generols behave like this?

I kno they want visa for their kids yada yada and other stuff. But there has to be some concrete reason for such levels of disinterest?

They are ((( involved ))) only on the level of sending fanciful GSQRs and such requirements vanish when importing.

By comparison Admirals have

>Warship Design Bureau as everyone knows, spec, design, weapons, electronics all decided by Navy, no ((( GSQRs ))) being sent to DRDO like the other two """"customers""" do

>Retired Commodores in BEL, BDL type PSUs, sometimes they reach the top leadership levels also.
Apparently these retired/serving afsars with the BEL guys wrote the CMS software for warships

>Retired Admirals sit on board of PSU Shipyards like MDL.

> ofc there are some serving Navy officers deputed in official capacity to oversee shipbuilding and the subsystem manufacture at DPSU and Shipyard.

This is the pattern also followed unironically by top tier MNC companies like Apple, they design their own stuff and are integrated with the manufacturer and the component suppliers to an autistic degree.
 
They are ((( involved ))) only on the level of sending fanciful GSQRs and such requirements vanish when importing.

By comparison Admirals have

>Warship Design Bureau as everyone knows, spec, design, weapons, electronics all decided by Navy, no ((( GSQRs ))) being sent to DRDO like the other two """"customers""" do

>Retired Commodores in BEL, BDL type PSUs, sometimes they reach the top leadership levels also.
Apparently these retired/serving afsars with the BEL guys wrote the CMS software for warships

>Retired Admirals sit on board of PSU Shipyards like MDL.

> ofc there are some serving Navy officers deputed in official capacity to oversee shipbuilding and the subsystem manufacture at DPSU and Shipyard.

This is the pattern also followed unironically by top tier MNC companies like Apple, they design their own stuff and are integrated with the manufacturer and the component suppliers to an autistic degree.
It's clear that Rajnath ji can't keep IAF's shenanigans under control. We need a no nonsense IDDM endorser as RM. We need another Parrikar.
 
They are ((( involved ))) only on the level of sending fanciful GSQRs and such requirements vanish when importing.

By comparison Admirals have

>Warship Design Bureau as everyone knows, spec, design, weapons, electronics all decided by Navy, no ((( GSQRs ))) being sent to DRDO like the other two """"customers""" do

>Retired Commodores in BEL, BDL type PSUs, sometimes they reach the top leadership levels also.
Apparently these retired/serving afsars with the BEL guys wrote the CMS software for warships

>Retired Admirals sit on board of PSU Shipyards like MDL.

> ofc there are some serving Navy officers deputed in official capacity to oversee shipbuilding and the subsystem manufacture at DPSU and Shipyard.

This is the pattern also followed unironically by top tier MNC companies like Apple, they design their own stuff and are integrated with the manufacturer and the component suppliers to an autistic degree.
It's over ! Imported AirForce wants only imports . No matter what indigenous manufacturers make , these import khor dalaals wants only Phoren maal at any cost. Ninda turtle is unable to manage anything...
 
It's clear that Rajnath ji can't keep IAF's shenanigans under control. We need a no nonsense IDDM endorser as RM. We need another Parrikar.

Ultimately the change has to come from IA/IAF itself.

It is rare to find a politician like Parrikar who can go after Genrols, but for the Govt-pushed IDDM there are many risks, like Govt being changed every 5 years, coalition collapse, the mantri in question not being effective in RM role ( like Ninda Turtle ) or as in previous years the Govt of the day and Defence minister may also want a cut of the Import bux.

To affect proper changes via govt pressure you need to have a competent and dedicated guy like Parikkar for like 20 years.

Genrols, Marshols, Admirals, Meelards, Babooze etc all are a yuge professional clique, only those matching the ((( views ))) of existing hierarchy of the clique get the promotions, others do not, these promotees then perpetuate the "institutional mindset" as it were, for Meelards it's giving Leftie-Liberal activist rulings, for Genrols it's Importmaxxxing, for Admirals it's building their ships.

This gives their behaviors as an institution a longer shelf-life than the tenure of a single guy or a small group which as it is may, for e.g the top Genrols with the Chief-of titles serve for 2 years on average and 3 years max.

Speaking of tenures, the "retired" ones are also sem2sem as serving ones, like the one mustachioed retired genrol interviewed by Coupta's employees recently bamboozling people on ATAGS/MGS vs the Israeli equivalent.

Or Shukla and Panag types having post-retirement careers of being darbari patrakars with a side of import-promotion.

A benign version of this is retired Navy officers being full time employees of BEL, BDL, DPSU Shipyards in some kind of managerial or senior engineering role.

You may think that certain import-lovers of the higher ranks can be "purged" but their replacements will have the same "institutional mindset" since they are handpicked by their deposed superiors.

At some point the Chings will gather the Dragon Balls necessary to first anschluss Taiwan and then wage a war on us to "show you your place".

From what we see of their forces we will lose this, because of the simple reason of it being an industrial war, Rafales, Strykers and Athos can't be replaced in time, and aside from the factory lead time there can be governmental delays like the Ukranians are facing.

There is an important fork here in the Day After.

Either Genrol/Marshals fix their org and give full support and collaboration to building defense platforms indigenously, realizing the wars of the future will be industrial ones like WW2

OR

Continue to full speed ahead import, and this will cause a weak and compliant govt of the day( the govt presiding over the defeat at war will most likely collapse or lose elections ) to sign various ((( treaties ))) with the US, in order to access their high-tech gear, in effect making us one of their vassals.

As their current behaviors and actions show, I have no hope for Genrols/Marshols and their respective services mending their ways before the inevitable 1962-Redux happens.
 
We need to get rid of the seniority promotion and switch to a merit based promotion system.
 

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