Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

[shade2]

GE F404 still facing mystery delays?

Looks like the Jernails will start pushing for F16 emergency procurements over any Tejas variants

 

[SlayingHell]

GE F404 still facing mystery delays?

Looks like the Jernails will start pushing for F16 emergency procurements over any Tejas variants

HAL geniuses kept delaying the F404 engine orders repeatedly, up until recently. It's almost as if they had a childish understanding of production lines, supply chain management, and the like. Someone should really spoon-feed them the basics – in high-tech industries with long lead times, scaling up or down requires massive investment and time. You can't just throw orders around on a whim and expect deliveries of 'x' units per year. It’s not like a roadside pakoda vendor bringing in his wife to scale up production!

 

[Blademaster]

HAL geniuses kept delaying the F404 engine orders repeatedly, up until recently. It's almost as if they had a childish understanding of production lines, supply chain management, and the like. Someone should really spoon-feed them the basics – in high-tech industries with long lead times, scaling up or down requires massive investment and time. You can't just throw orders around on a whim and expect deliveries of 'x' units per year. It’s not like a roadside pakoda vendor bringing in his wife to scale up production!

Yes but the problem is that they couldn't start ordering the engines until the GoI ponied up the money and approve the purchase so the blame really lies with GoI and MoD and their myopic way of procuring weapons.

 

[SlayingHell]

Yes but the problem is that they couldn't start ordering the engines until the GoI ponied up the money and approve the purchase so the blame really lies with GoI and MoD and their myopic way of procuring weapons.

The blame also lies equally on HAL for blindly trusting companies like GE with their delivery timelines. Every business out there promises the moon from roadside Samosa guy to GE, and it’s HAL’s responsibility to carefully evaluate those timelines before relying on them.

 

[Blademaster]

The blame also lies equally on HAL for blindly trusting companies like GE with their delivery timelines. Every business out there promises the moon from roadside Samosa guy to GE, and it’s HAL’s responsibility to carefully evaluate those timelines before relying on them.

No I think the GE did warn them and told them that they needed a certain amount of time and confirmed orders by that date and when none was forthcoming, GE, to no fault of them, closed down that line to save money and in the time of COVID, entire supply chains were disrupted and there were other higher priorities. So I tend to give some leeway to GE's explanations about the delay in the engines.

 

[truthsoldier]

HAL geniuses kept delaying the F404 engine orders repeatedly, up until recently. It's almost as if they had a childish understanding of production lines, supply chain management, and the like. Someone should really spoon-feed them the basics – in high-tech industries with long lead times, scaling up or down requires massive investment and time. You can't just throw orders around on a whim and expect deliveries of 'x' units per year. It’s not like a roadside pakoda vendor bringing in his wife to scale up production!

MoD took 3 long yrs just to negotiate price of tejas with a PSU under them. We can't hope a company to place this big orders without the money on the table

 

[Spitfire IX]

The blame also lies equally on HAL for blindly trusting companies like GE with their delivery timelines. Every business out there promises the moon from roadside Samosa guy to GE, and it’s HAL’s responsibility to carefully evaluate those timelines before relying on them.

I recall reading that in 2021 GE accepted the order for the engines for the 83 Kk1A but informed HAL that it could not guarantee delivery as indicated to HAL. At the time Covid-19 was rampant, I think, affecting GE and suppliers.

If you are informed before a contract is signed that delivery might be delayed and delivery is delayed, you are not in a position to complain too bitterly, I think.

 

[VictorDelta4]

 

[SlayingHell]

I read a news that the Tejas mk2 is gonna be taken to ONERA for further optimizations...so are these penny pinchers gonna take AMCA also there and risk leaking everything to enemy in case?

 

[Vishnugupt]

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Why every Import Air Force General do the same <Redacted> in his first speech?? I have been seeing this from last almost 15 years.

Is it a IAF ritual??

Just to remind their legacy......Israeli airforce dropped more bombs in single mission to kill Nasrallah than total bombs Indian airforce dropped during whole Kargil operation.

Like many previous Generals, he will achieve total Zero result in the end.

Mod edit: Members are requested to mind their language on a public forum.

 

[shade2]

Why every Import Air Force General do the same <Redacted> in his first speech?? I have been seeing this from last almost 15 years.

Is it a IAF ritual??

Just to remind their legacy......Israeli airforce dropped more bombs in single mission to kill Nasrallah than total bombs Indian airforce dropped during whole Kargil operation.

Like many previous Generals, he will achieve total Zero result in the end.

Because when the IAF inevitably shits the bed in any coming war, the Gernail can put the blame on GoI not giving them new *cough* IMPORTED *cough* planes.

 

[Vishnugupt]

Because when the IAF inevitably shits the bed in any coming war, the Gernail can put the blame on GoI not giving them new *cough* IMPORTED *cough* planes.

In 15 years instead of crying they could have resolved the issue.

Please don't use word like shit in the bed. Criticize them as an institution not like personal.

 

[SlayingHell]

In 15 years instead of crying they could have resolved the issue.

Please don't use word like shit in the bed. Criticize them as an institution not like personal.

I often wonder if some people suffer from what I call the "upper middle class immigrant" syndrome. This refers to a class of individuals who are content with the status quo and unwilling to take risks. While I believe the lower-level soldiers are true patriots, ready to sacrifice their lives without hesitation, my concern lies with the top brass. Are they becoming cowardly and meek, either because they are too comfortable with their current situation—without any focus on war preparedness, including the well-being of their families—or is there something more sinister at play that is holding their courage hostage?

 

[Pundit Pikachu]

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You have to be a special breed of shameless to say we are lacking in production when an entire fuckin helicopter production plant is sitting idle Because Dalal Generals couldn't be bothered to fast-track the procurement and order the needed helicopters (Read LUH and LCH)

 

[Vishnugupt]

You have to be a special breed of shameless to say we are lacking in production when an entire fuckin helicopter production plant is sitting idle Because Dalal Generals couldn't be bothered to fast-track the procurement and order the needed helicopters (Read LUH and LCH)

From recent news DRDO is developing NAG MK2 missile. It is also possible that Generals has managed to kill NAG and HeLina missiles so in this case, no Desi ATGM for LCH for next 5-6 years.

 

[shade2]

I often wonder if some people suffer from what I call the "upper middle class immigrant" syndrome. This refers to a class of individuals who are content with the status quo and unwilling to take risks. While I believe the lower-level soldiers are true patriots, ready to sacrifice their lives without hesitation, my concern lies with the top brass. Are they becoming cowardly and meek, either because they are too comfortable with their current situation—without any focus on war preparedness, including the well-being of their families—or is there something more sinister at play that is holding their courage hostage?

Whatever i say below goes for the Imported Army gernails also apart from the Imported Air Force Air Marshlols

Courage and Cowardly ka pata nahi, what is true is that they are all treacherous, they deliberately hold up induction of any domestically produced platforms so that they can arm-twist the govt the buy overpriced phoren maal with any onerous T&C the foreign vendor specifies( in case its a certain superpower ), today this takes place under EmErGeNcY pRocUrEmEnt.

Now the complains behind this is always that the domestic maal is defective, bad quality or doesn't meet their madeup bullshit specifications, if this is the case they can themselves design the gear and oversee the manufacturing like how the Navy does with it's atmanirbhar ships, they even collaborate with PSUs like BEL for any electronics stuff they want, the Gucci Gangers on the Special Forces thread even say that the Navy's MARCOS are better equipped than the PARA SF of the Army that once again sees more "action" than Marcos ever do...

But they don't do this, it shows they aren't serious about the preparedness of their own force, which would mean the deaths of their men and the defeat of their nation.

Now you can put this down to simple greed based on the "complementary benefits" provided by the foreign vendors

• lots of cash in swiss bank accounts
• premium imported gori pussi
• foreign country resettlement for gernail and family
• admission in top tier phoren university + settlement for Jernail's kids

If it is simple greed why isn't the Navy infected with this plague? It's almost as if the Navy is the last to see the "action" of war and therefore doesn't need such infiltration of import khor dalals.

It's almost as if this plague in the IA and IAF isn't a function of pure greed by Gernails and shilling by Foreign Vendors but a conspiracy made to degrade the fighting capability of the two main armed forces wings in case of a war thanks to no new equipment, or very little new equipment being procured because the Gernails don't want desi and only imported, and the Govt doesn't want imported unless necessary and pushes desi.

Most worryingly the Dalal lobby seems impervious to any central govt including the current one.
Perhaps Shekhar Coupta's one article that gave him his nickname was true after all.

 

[Pundit Pikachu]

From recent news DRDO is developing NAG MK2 missile. It is also possible that Generals has managed to kill NAG and HeLina missiles so in this case, no Desi ATGM for LCH for next 5-6 years.

As far as I am aware Nag Mk 1 (along with the Abomination called NAMICA) is dead, but by some miracle Helina has survived and might see some limited service.
There was a tender related to it released sometime ago


God knows what happened to SANT, that missile is exactly what our Helicopters need to have a competitive edge against the Pakis

 

[Vishnugupt]

As far as I am aware Nag Mk 1 (along with the Abomination called NAMICA) is dead, but by some miracle Helina has survived and might see some limited service.
There was a tender related to it released sometime ago
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God knows what happened to SANT, that missile is exactly what our Helicopters need to have a competitive edge against the Pakis

What I believe UN Generals are totally not interested in capability development. They are more focused on kickbacks money.

UN Generals earn good ammount of money by maintaining 5 or 10 imported plateform.

For example, maintaining 22 Apache in IAF need more money then buying new weapons.

General never forget to spend maximum allowed limit (300 crores) because it doesn't required approval from MoD.

UN Generals use foreign machinary more in peacetime so it will require more maintenance hence more kickback money.

Judiciary and Indian armed forces has gone beyond any possibility of repair. I am not hearing any progress about Theaterisation from years

 

[Patriots]

Nag, Helina and dhruvaastra will be ordered , may be in limited numbers

 

[Clawreed]

What happened to lch orders? Did the new chief say anything?