Indian Navy Developments & Discussions

[Ayan Barat]

Why else would I use the term 'hedgehog'??

Spoiler: Maybe coz they're so dang cute

 

[Blood+]

Spoiler: Maybe coz they're so dang cute

View attachment 18065

Hmmm... in hindsight, I should have used Sea Urchin instead.

 

[darkflame]

View: https://x.com/IndiannavyMedia/status/1865655019120304528

 

[rohitb3]

View: https://x.com/IndiannavyMedia/status/1865655019120304528

doesn even have VLS launchers for SAMs, if i am not wrong.

 

[125mm_Smoothbore]

doesn even have VLS launchers for SAMs, if i am not wrong.

Very wrong
perhaps this is the first talwar class frigate to house the vls launched shtil missiles

 

[rohitb3]

View attachment 18089
Very wrong
perhaps this is the first talwar class frigate to house the vls launched shtil missiles

aah, good to know! any idea how many SAMs ?

 

[Binayak95]

View attachment 18089
Very wrong
perhaps this is the first talwar class frigate to house the vls launched shtil missiles

It is the first of the Talwars to have VLS launched Shtils. All 4 of these follow ons will have the same, and will then get reverse rolled onto the remaining 6.

 

[Blood+]

It is the first of the Talwars to have VLS launched Shtils. All 4 of these follow ons will have the same, and will then get reverse rolled onto the remaining 6.

Wouldn't it be better if they received the VL-SRSAM along with a radar upgrade during their midlife refit??

 

[Fatalis]

It is the first of the Talwars to have VLS launched Shtils. All 4 of these follow ons will have the same, and will then get reverse rolled onto the remaining 6.

They are supposed to get MRSAM

 

[Ayan Barat]

Wouldn't it be better if they received the VL-SRSAM along with a radar upgrade during their midlife refit??

15kg warhead on VL-SRSAM vs 70kg on Buk. I don't think navy would be confident enough to make VL-SRSAM the only ADS on frontline anti-ship vessels.
This 80km range of VL-SRSAM also sounds too good to be true...though I'm not sure about this, so would leave that until more data is there.

Though it'd be better to add atleast two VL-SRSAM VLS on all ships together with the existing ADS system. Why waste expensive Baraks in everything.

 

[Blood+]

15kg warhead on VL-SRSAM vs 70kg on Buk. I don't think navy would be confident enough to make VL-SRSAM the only ADS on frontline anti-ship vessels.

Hmmm... you're probably right. But VL-SRSAM is also supposed to be more accurate and agile than the Buk due to the former's active radar guidance and its higher lateral acceleration, so it may not require as big a warhead. My rationale is that, you would be able to pack more of the VL-SRSAMs, probably twice as many (in theory at least).

This 80km range of VL-SRSAM also sounds too good to be true...though I'm not sure about this, so would leave that until more data is there.

I'm almost certain it's a load of bs to be honest, 40-45 km (maybe 50, max) seems the most reasonable estimate to me. So, in terms of range, they are probably comparable.

Though it'd be better to add atleast two VL-SRSAM VLS on all ships together with the existing ADS system. Why waste expensive Baraks in everything.

Exactly.

 

[125mm_Smoothbore]

aah, good to know! any idea how many SAMs ?

24 missiles

 

[125mm_Smoothbore]

15kg warhead on VL-SRSAM vs 70kg on Buk. I don't think navy would be confident enough to make VL-SRSAM the only ADS on frontline anti-ship vessels.
This 80km range of VL-SRSAM also sounds too good to be true...though I'm not sure about this, so would leave that until more data is there.

Though it'd be better to add atleast two VL-SRSAM VLS on all ships together with the existing ADS system. Why waste expensive Baraks in everything.

I dont think so personally i think vlsrsam is perfect for tasks like this ie to defend smaller vessels its supposed to be on the ngmv too

80km range is bs tbh but air defence missile depends on many factors such as direction of target speed of target etc too so we can guesstimate it be around 30-50 km mark

 

[Ayan Barat]

My rationale is that, you would be able to pack more of the VL-SRSAMs, probably twice as many (in theory at least).

Whenever I say that Indian system are generally not as "refined" as their international counterparts or the whole MIC of ours lack the level of out-of-the-box thinking needed, people get offended.
But I've my own biases to say that.

(8 cell VL-SRSAM compared to a 12 cell Shtil-1; the cells are just for rough idea but the outer dimensions are accurate)

Worth noting is the fact that a single VL-SRSAM is approximately 200kg whereas for Shtil-1 it's 600kg

 

[Ayan Barat]

I dont think so personally i think vlsrsam is perfect for tasks like this ie to defend smaller vessels its supposed to be on the ngmv too

Yup, that's why I specifically mentioned this thing

frontline anti-ship vessels

For a Kamorta whose only job is sub hunting or a fast attack missile boat where weight is everything; it absolutely makes sense to have a lighter VL-SRSAM.

Bas as soon as you're adding a 8 cell BrahMos launcher you're making a dedicated anti-ship vessel. And I don't think it's good to have just VL-SRSAM as your only ADS when the adversary you're going on against will be firing everything from supersonic CMs to even BMs.

 

[Blood+]

Whenever I say that Indian system are generally not as "refined" as their international counterparts or the whole MIC of ours lack the level of out-of-the-box thinking needed, people get offended.
But I've my own biases to say that.
View attachment 18108
(8 cell VL-SRSAM compared to a 12 cell Shtil-1; the cells are just for rough idea but the outer dimensions are accurate)

Worth noting is the fact that a single VL-SRSAM is approximately 200kg whereas for Shtil-1 it's 600kg

I know, that's precisely why I added that little disclaimer of 'in theory'.

 

[Ayan Barat]

Few days ago there were some chatters about Aegis Combat System
Stumbled upon a 46 years old footage

View: https://x.com/samuel_hayden_/status/1866161485925466346?s=19

 

[Charlie]

With the new shipbuilding policy those defunct shipyard should be sold and the unfinished hull should be sold back to navy with upgrades.

 

[vampyrbladez]

With the new shipbuilding policy those defunct shipyard should be sold and the unfinished hull should be sold back to navy with upgrades.

These vessels could be acquired by intelligence agencies cheaply to create expeditionary vessels for black sites and SOF.


View: https://x.com/WarshipCam/status/1700999481133760971

The shipyard is under new management now.

Pipavav Shipyard in Gujarat resumes operations, repairs an Indian Coast Guard Vessel​

https://www.thehindubusinessline.co...indian-coast-guard-vessel/article68937521.ece

 

[Ayan Barat]

unfinished hull should be sold back to navy with upgrades

Unfinished hulls are probably the cheapest thing among all other high-value stuffs on a ship. So thinking about making ships from those rotten hulls in 3rd pic would be like buying a horse after finding a saddle.

Only two hulls are completed enough to even be viable for a consideration

Shachi and Shruti.
First you'll need a through inspection as they're sitting there for more than five years, then a repair, followed by procuring all the costly stuff like engine, gearbox, radar...only to get this

A 1,500t Offshore Patrol Vessel with just a 76mm SRGM and two AK-630s.

But you specifically said upgrading it, so let's look at that too. Upgrading it won't be as simple as we had done previously on bigger ships like Delhi or Brahmaputra where you just swap one weapon system with another. You'd need some Kiev - Vikramaditya level of modifications to add better radars, BrahMos and ADS. And in case you want just enough upgrades for using it as an OPV then again, 11 new OPVs are already on order.

But then again, all these for just two ships when it's always better to have atleast three according to the Rule of Thirds. In my opinion the cost Vs value won't be significant enough to justify dealing with these girls.

If these two were even big corvette hulls then also I'd have agreed to you wholeheartedly.