Indian Air Force: News & Discussions

[Indianhawk]

I asked what EXACTLY private sector gonna learn with MRFA? How is that different from a private sector being given incharge of AMCA Or LCA Mk2. Like private sector already does majority of the work like Only front fuselage comes from HAL with remaining from Private Vendors in case of Tejas. Canopy, Display, Radar comes from Private Companies.

Are you saying somehow a 4.5th gen technologies impart gonna be translated to 5th gen magically?

This is exactly what the debate is about.
Proponents of mrfa argue that rafale manufacturing techniques are way ahead of what hal is doing now.

Proponents of lca mk2 argue there is nothing to learn from rafale we are almost there and could do better if money is invested domestically.

This is what I was relaying to the forum and not arguing for mrfa.

IAF obviously want rafale in large numbers and to maintain such fleet it wants spares , engine maintenance and in future mid life upgrades here in India itself. That much tot is atleast required otherwise rafale becomes a white elephant.

 

[redpanda]

It will learn similar to what hal learned from su30mki manufacturing. Idea is that private sector with it's greed will actually learn much more than what PSU have ever done through various tot programs.

Regarding composites lca has more composite surface compared to rafale. That private sector is already learning by making components parts for lca.

Mrfa was supposed to bring whole ecosystem of which will move from assembly to manufacturing from local sources over time.

Argument against this is that mk2 and Amca will do that much better.

Private sector is very reluctant in itself beyond projects like small & medium weapon system, drones, etc. They rarely seems to be interested in big projects like these. Because they don't see huge margin to earn money with it. And they fear losses. Unless government cover for their losses I don't think they would ever participate. Here I'm not talking about some subsystems, some parts, private firms already do that. I'm talking about inhouse assembly line for whole aircraft. I don't think any private company is ready to offer that.

 

[705-Lira]

If this was to be private they should have got a room. It was spoken in public because it was meant to be public.

It must feel awesome, amazing and refreshing berating your own industry at an airshow attended by hundred of foreign delegations, isn't it?

 

[Brood Father]

It must feel awesome, amazing and refreshing berating your own industry at an airshow attended by hundred of foreign delegations, isn't it?

Well , if HAL is not able to deliver on the promises what options chief have especially the guy who has been with Tejas program since long time

We are currently on 31 sqd strength which will come to 29 so his frustration is understandable

 

[Nutcracker]

Well , if HAL is not able to deliver on the promises what options chief have especially the guy who has been with Tejas program since long time

We are currently on 31 sqd strength which will come to 29 so his frustration is understandable

Did our squadron deplete to 30 because current LCA order's delivery is delayed by 1 year ?
ACM is barking up the wrong tree.

 

[Spitfire IX]

It must feel awesome, amazing and refreshing berating your own industry at an airshow attended by hundred of foreign delegations, isn't it?

Awkward to have your shortcomings publicly discussed but I doubt that foreign delegations' high opinion of HAL would have been damaged by the ACM's revelations. Any potential Tejas customer would associate the aircraft and HAL with massive delays.

 

[iNorthernerOn9]

Today Pakis have signed deal with Turkiya to acquire this... numbers unknown



& our generals/marshals/admirals are wondering & commenting about state of Paki economy instead of doing their...

 

[Indianhawk]

It must feel awesome, amazing and refreshing berating your own industry at an airshow attended by hundred of foreign delegations, isn't it?

Well it's not like air chief wouldn't meet hal officials anywhere else to convey his concerns.

 

[Brood Father]

Did our squadron deplete to 30 because current LCA order's delivery is delayed by 1 year ?
ACM is barking up the wrong tree.

IAF wanted to get the Rafales but government said no , they were forced to get Tejas (not that I am against it) and now we hear there is still pending critical integration and that too when China and even Pakistan have better jets than us
So it's not IAF fault here ..Babus sitting comfortably in AC rooms do not care of our soldiers life when they go down in outdated jets ..

 

[trombone]

hard to believe our country's security is in the hands of a bunch of quota engineers and pension uncles at HAL.

 

[Ayan Barat]

hard to believe our country's security is in the hands of a bunch of quota engineers and pension uncles at HAL.

Tell me the best possible alternative to HAL that we currently have and I'll go personally drop a 2000lbs on HAL's headquarters.

 

[Azaad]

View: https://www.youtube.com/live/-ot8efd4EcI?si=9Y-j4hLHrFigaLnH

Damn ! Saurav Jha is on a roll , this time reverting back to the old format of only answering questions from the audience on IAH focusing almost entirely on the IAF. Some good reveals here .

 

[Blademaster]

View: https://www.youtube.com/live/-ot8efd4EcI?si=9Y-j4hLHrFigaLnH

Damn ! Saurav Jha is on a roll , this time reverting back to the old format of only answering questions from the audience on IAH focusing almost entirely on the IAF. Some good reveals here .

Pls give me the TLDR version.

 

[705-Lira]

hard to believe our country's security is in the hands of a bunch of quota engineers and pension uncles at HAL.

You are free to open up your own shop and bid for the contract, no one is stopping you.

 

[705-Lira]

IAF wanted to get the Rafales but government said no , they were forced to get Tejas (not that I am against it) and now we hear there is still pending critical integration and that too when China and even Pakistan have better jets than us
So it's not IAF fault here ..Babus sitting comfortably in AC rooms do not care of our soldiers life when they go down in outdated jets ..

Money doesn't grow on trees.
The MRFA is a $30 billion bondoggle with literally zero value addition to the local industry, it is unfeasible today and more so a decade ago.
IAF seems more than happy to sacrifice equally important programs like aerial refuellers, AEW, SOJ, ISTARs in the endless pursuit of MRFA which does little to guarantee survivability in an all out brawl with PLAAF.
Rafale is crazy expensive for what it offers, and it's not like what it offers is out of this world, watch the Navy shill out Rs.63,000 crore for barely 26 aircraft.

 

[Brood Father]

Money doesn't grow on trees.
The MRFA is a $30 billion bondoggle with literally zero value addition to the local industry, it is unfeasible today and more so a decade ago.
IAF seems more than happy to sacrifice equally important programs like aerial refuellers, AEW, SOJ, ISTARs in the endless pursuit of MRFA which does little to guarantee survivability in an all out brawl with PLAAF.
Rafale is crazy expensive for what it offers, and it's not like what it offers is out of this world, watch the Navy shill out Rs.63,000 crore for barely 26 aircraft.

Money doesn't grow on tree but National security of the country does ?
The role of IAF is not to either make jets or to fund and research critical technologies. Their role is to safeguard country which they are doing with reduced squadrons by flying obsolete airframes and risking lives of our airmen

I completely understand why government is not keen on MRFA but what about alternatives? Tejas MKIA was promised with critical techs but even that is not available and HAL is conveniently blaming everything on GE engines ..why they are not able to integrate Astra missiles or python missiles ?

This is not IAF job to deliver jets better HAL step up or don't cry when import lobby takes over

 

[705-Lira]

Money doesn't grow on tree but National security of the country does ?
The role of IAF is not to either make jets or to fund and research critical technologies. Their role is to safeguard country which they are doing with reduced squadrons by flying obsolete airframes and risking lives of our airmen

I completely understand why government is not keen on MRFA but what about alternatives? Tejas MKIA was promised with critical techs but even that is not available and HAL is conveniently blaming everything on GE engines ..why they are not able to integrate Astra missiles or python missiles ?

This is not IAF job to deliver jets better HAL step up or don't cry when import lobby takes over

"The role of IAF is not to either make jets or to fund and research critical technologies".

This is exactly where the issue is, the mindset.
They would love to sit on sidelines while product development is ongoing rather than getting themselves involved and then become critiques when the finished product rolls out.

 

[aim120]

Trump just said F35 is being offered to India .

 

[Nibbler]

Trump just said F35 is being offered to India .

He said they are working on paving the way to f35 or something like that

What does that mean? 100 f21 first then f35?

Fuk that

 

[darkflame]

https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/pm-...-art-f-35-fighter-jets-to-india-7706114/amp/1

Trump Says US To Sell State-Of-Art F-35 Fighter Jets To India​